Re: The X-Files

I don't mind the Mulder/Scully romance. It's not the dealbreaker for me that it is for fans (or for Chris Carter). I think Informant's opinion that Mulder and Scully had no business getting romantic, full-stop, is a very strange opinion for a writer. Writers, by their nature, should see the possibilities in any avenue; whether or not they care to explore them is a different question.

Chris Carter is not really a writer who thinks in terms of characterization. Instead, characters are mouthpieces for a certain point of view. Mulder was the believer. Scully was the skeptic. That was the end of it as far as he was concerned. He felt that it was up to the actors to make these icons feel like people; he stuck to writing the believer and the skeptic. And that was fine and well and good. The show certainly could have carried on for 11 seasons and two films with Mulder and Scully as professional colleagues who, due to their hangups and traumas and repressions and demons, would never be a couple.

Seasons 1 - 5 present a near infinite number of reasons as to why Mulder and Scully shouldn't be a couple. They are complete loners for the most part with no life outside their work. Scully's daddy issues have made it difficult for her to bond with others; the death of her sister traumatized her from forming new relationships with others. Mulder is tormented by his sister's disappearance, his parents' complicity and his penchant for pornography made it quite clear: despite having sexual desires, he simply doesn't allow himself anything except for the X-Files.

"War of the Copraphages" have Mulder bringing a town to disaster with his paranoia; "Clyde Bruckman's Final Repose" present Mulder and Scully as detached from human experience; "Never Again" indicates that Mulder and Scully's relationship is profoundly toxic and dysfunctional -- they are horrible for each other because Mulder is a selfish, myopic misfit and Scully is a self-isolating workaholic.

But FIGHT THE FUTURE had Mulder and Scully almost kiss, interrupted only by a bee. Once that happened, there was no going back. And it could have been fine except due to Carter's discomfort with romance (and characterization in general), the romantic arc was badly mishandled despite being strangely well-written. Season 6 has Mulder and Scully kicked off the X-Files Division. They are no longer partners. They are no longer assigned X-Files cases. For 12 episodes, almost half of Season 6, Mulder and Scully were cut off from the central concept of the series.

It had almost no effect on the show's storytelling engine whatsoever. "Drive" has Mulder and Scully blundering into an X-File, "Triangle" shows that Mulder will pursue them outside of work hours. However, the removal of the X-Files from THE X-FILES led to a focus on Mulder and Scully as the show rather than their work.

In "Triangle," when Mulder fears he might die, he kisses a Scully lookalike and later tells the real Scully that he loves her (to which she replies, "Oh, brother," thinking it's the pain medication talking). "Dreamland I - II" have Mulder and Scully travelling to Area 51 with the two arguing along the way, Scully wondering why they are chasing aliens when it's not their job, when these are their off-hours, when she and Mulder could be living normal lives. "This is a normal life," Mulder says dismissively.

The "Dreamland" two-parter, simply from the teaser, makes it clear that even when Mulder and Scully aren't working on the X-Files, they will spend their spare time together. Following paranormal events. Seeking strangeness to explore. The significance of the teaser is easily missed, but given the context of the episodes leading up to it, it's impossible to see Mulder and Scully as anything but a couple (romantic or not) who like to get together to look into weird events in the peculiar universe that they inhabit.

At this point, with Mulder trying to kiss Scully and Scully being receptive in FIGHT THE FUTURE followed by Mulder telling Scully he loves her in "Triangle" and "Dreamland" establishing that they don't need the X-Files to be partners, the stage was set for Mulder and Scully to truly become a couple. "How the Ghosts Stole Christmas" show that Scully, despite her stated complaints, would actually be happy to stake out a haunted house with Mulder on Christmas Eve rather than spend it with her family.

And then we go to "The Rain King" where Scully tells a woman whose best friend has fallen for her that sometimes, we get close to someone as a friend but then one day, we may come to find that someone we saw as a colleague and associate has become the only life partner we could ever dream of. Later, on the dance floor, we see Mulder and Scully standing separately but dancing in perfect sync to the music, neither one noticing that the other is in step.

If Mulder and Scully were being written as characters permitted to drive their own story (as Informant has always advised), this is where the romance would have started. But it didn't; Mulder and Scully never notice and then Diana Fowley, Mulder's ex(-wife?) returned to the show to make Scully jealous and put her at odds with Mulder.

It didn't make any sense. David Duchovny was deeply frustrated by Season 6 teasing a Mulder and Scully romance but not delivering. He said that it was clear to him: the writers were holding off on a romance until the series finale and without any finale in sight, they wouldn't complete the arc. To him, this made the show creatively corrupt and he wanted out. Season 7 attempted to have the romance in a very non-committal fashion where Mulder and Scully may or may not be an offscreen couple, allowing Chris Carter to ignore it (although he was seized by the idea of Scully ending the season pregnant).

The truth is that if Carter wanted Mulder and Scully kept separate, it would have been very appropriate to have them couple up in "Rain King" only to discover that their respective neuroses, idiosyncrasies and peculiarities (as established in Seasons 1 - 5) would make it impossible for them to work together and be a couple. They could have played out the romance and moved on to where Mulder and Scully ended up anyway by Season 10: the amicable exes. Or they could have kept them a couple and gone the Season 7 route a little earlier with a focus on their professional lives but an episode here or there that dealt with their off-duty lives.

One of the best and worst episodes of Season 6 is "Arcadia" where Mulder and Scully go undercover as husband and wife. It's very cute. But it's surprisingly simplistic where Mulder and Scully grumble about chores and attention when Season 1 - 5 had introduced plenty of more individual and specific reasons for why they would chafe: Mulder is a slob with no room in his life for intimacy; Scully is a neatfreak and has no tolerance for an overgrown college student. Mulder has no interest in socializing with the neighbours; Scully wants to contribute to the community. And so forth.

But what we got from the series as a whole wasn't Mulder and Scully getting together because it made sense at that point or staying apart for good and valid reasons. They were kept apart from Season 6 to the last few episodes of Season 7 because the showrunner rejected the proposal; they finally got together in "all things" because the actress rejected his rejection.

To me, "Plus One" represented the best of Carter's suspense and horror writing and the worst of his character-oriented writing. The horror story is pretty good, but the conversations between Mulder and Scully are incomprehensible.

Why is Scully lying in Mulder's arms worrying that Mulder might find a younger woman to bear his children? Is she unaware that they're in bed together? Has she met this dysfunctional mess of a man with no interest in sex outside Scully who satiates any desires with porn? Why is Mulder flirting with Scully like they haven't had a child and spent a good portion of 2000 and then 2002 to 2008 living together in a common-law marriage? Why is Scully acting like sex with Mulder is a desire she wouldn't ever voice when they've been spending their off-hours going on vacations to Nevada since 1998?

I don't think Chris Carter knows who these people are outside one being the believer and the other being the skeptic.

Re: The X-Files

I'm not opposed to the idea of romantic pairings in general, but I think that they sometimes happen less because the characters demand it, and more because the audience (and writers) expect it. It's not just true with Mulder and Scully, it's also true with Oliver and Felicity, and I'm sure it's true with many more characters on screen that I'm too lazy to think of right now.

Mulder and Scully are, in a lot of ways, like Sam and Dean Winchester. They didn't choose to be together, but once they are together, they have a strong bond and partnership. Some in the fan community view this as sexual (do not Google the word Wincest, I warn you), but the truth is that it's not. There's a need for a lot of people to sexualize relationships where people have chemistry, but sometime you have to recognize where that chemistry comes from.

Mulder and Scully were never a couple where you expected them to fall into some frenzied makeout session at any moment. Their dynamic was based on the fact that they push off of each other, not the fact that they're drawn toward each other. It's a strong partnership, but not romance. Mulder and Scully should be the partners with absolutely zero chance of being sexually involved, who can grab a beer and complain about their actual spouses (if they had them). They should be a safe zone for each other, and for the audience, in an otherwise incredibly dangerous world that they live in. Being romantically linked creates drama between them that shouldn't exist. And rather than have a pretty unique relationship that we don't often see on TV, they become like every other man and woman who appear on screen together on every show.

What has their romantic pairing added to the show? The best part of "Plus One" was the push and pull that reminded me of the earlier X-Files episodes. He'd make some sexual innuendo that was totally safe because there was zero chance of it happening, and she'd rebut with some sharp comeback.
The romantic pairing has given us an awkward relationship between the characters, because they can't be the partners that they once were, but they also kinda need to be the partners that they once were, because it's the premise of the show. There's always this random, useless element sitting between them in every scene now.
And what else has the pairing given us? William? Even though the story could have been done in other ways, it just went nowhere. He's some vaguely powerful person who has had not much of an impact on the show at all.

People think that having two characters fall in love will cement their bond and make the whole thing that much stronger, but that's not always the case. It's important to recognize when two characters shouldn't go there, and I think the X-Files is one of those cases. Rather than bring the characters together, the sexualization of that relationship has created division between them, and an awkwardness. The safe zone (friend zone?) is gone, and where do they go from here?

I agree that the execution of the romance was poorly handled. If they were going to go there, they should have just gone there. However, I don't think that putting them together was ever going to turn out well for the series. A married couple with children, who are partners in some oddball FBI division, sharing a one-desk office in the basement, and hunting monsters? It sounds like a premise that might work if we're talking about a small town sheriff's department, or a PI firm, but it just looks silly when it's the FBI.


Yeah, I'm a writer, and I'm supposed to be able to envision all of the potential routes that a story could take. However, there is usually a path of least resistance, where the story naturally wants to go. If you ignore that and force it to go in another direction, the story feels wrong. I think that's what happened here. The story wasn't properly executed because there was no proper execution.

To me, watching Mulder and Scully kiss is like watching Sam and Dean kiss, or Buffy and Giles. It doesn't make me all warm inside, it makes me a little grossed out. They have a huge amount of chemistry and a strong relationship... but she's more like the sister that he never had a chance to have than she is the woman that he wants to make wild, passionate love to.

Please be informed that the political, scientific, sociological, economic and legal views expressed in Informant's posts and social media accounts do not reflect any consensus of Sliders.tv.

Re: The X-Files

"The Lost Art of Forehead Sweat" was a fun episode. It was an okay episode, which could have easily been a solidly good episode, but suffered again from some writer laziness, and a few spots of actor weakness.

First, I want to say that I'm not sure what the hell happened in the episode, or where reality lies. But that's fine, because it's a long standing tradition in episodes like this. We just kinda go with it because it's fun. The episode is a confusing mess, which is kinda the point. But it's a fun confusing mess. smile

The episode sold the idea of the Mandela Effect, and presented it in a way that all of us can relate to, and which most of us have probably experienced. It also managed to explore the idea of fake news, and the idea that reality doesn't matter anymore. The truth is out there, but it's not as out there as the lies that people are willing to believe.

These concepts are timeless. They have mass appeal. They're something that the audience can connect with.

So, the problem with the episode comes in when the writer, Darin Morgan in this case, decides to make the story more about him. The weekly updates on where Mulder and company stand on the state of now-year-old politics is getting frustrating. I'm a big boy and I can handle some politics, but The X-Files was never a political commentary series (mostly because it was on the air in a time when criticizing the government would have meant criticizing someone that they liked and supported). While the show had occasional remarks about current events, they rarely tried to be petty about it. For the most part, the show could be escapist fun. It's much harder to enjoy the revival as escapist when they keep dragging real-world politics into it.

This isn't to say that they need to act as though politics don't exist. The Ted Cruz/JFK joke would have actually been a funny joke if they had delivered it cleanly. "This guy's father was responsible for his assassination" is a joke in that moment. "This idiot's father..." is a jab. One is in good humor, the other is petty and small.

The inauguration gag felt like a jab that didn't quite land, so it felt more like a shrugged off joke than a jab. That's fine. It was fun enough for that moment.

The bit at the end with the alien using the Trump quote just didn't work. It's like they couldn't think of anything else that the alien could say, so they went with that and hoped that people would chuckle out of reflex. The alien could have given numerous reasons for ditching the plan to explore humanity, from social media to reality TV, but the writer got lazy. Rather than come up with a joke, he came across as someone who didn't know politics but wanted to make a political joke. Which is weird, because the Cruz moment (failure that it was) gave me the opposite impression.

I don't know... I'm not all against political humor, but it's just been badly done on this show, and it's been needlessly done. I don't see the point in needlessly insulting the audience. It's so beneath this show, and always takes me out of the story. It always seems like those moments are more about the writers than the characters, and that's not good. (like in the last X-Files movie when they pan to the picture of Bush... it served Chris Carter, but not the story. At all)

In terms of acting, it just seemed like Duchovny and Anderson couldn't keep up with the comedy at times. Some of Duchovny's dialogue seemed disconnected, as though they had filmed his coverage at a different time than the other actor, so their back and forth was out of pace. It wasn't the whole episode, but moments in the episode.

But like I said, I thought the episode was pretty fun overall. I just don't know why the writers keep shooting themselves in the foot.


Interesting things to note:

For the second time this season, we're presented with the idea that this could be some other reality (universe, computer program, etc). We're presented with the notion that however we remember the show is right, and this whole thing could just be another universe that doesn't alienate the original series in any way.

The message seems directly aimed at this revival when Scully decides not to eat the dessert thing, wishing to remember it the way it was instead. Also when Mulder finds the episode of that TV show from his fond childhood memory and pops it in, only to discover that this isn't even an episode of the show he actually loved after all. It's a cheap copy of the show he loved.

We're also presented with a "conclusion" to the alien mythology that highlights how absurdly convoluted the whole thing has been, and the fact that we're being asked to kinda forget that the finale from last season ever happened.

To me, it seemed as if Morgan was taking some subtle jabs at Chris Carter and some of the weird decisions that have gone into making this revival. But that could just be in my head.


The episode definitely gave the audience a lot to chew on. I just wish that it had been a little tighter in the scripting.

Please be informed that the political, scientific, sociological, economic and legal views expressed in Informant's posts and social media accounts do not reflect any consensus of Sliders.tv.

Re: The X-Files

I really enjoyed the episode.  The quirky X-Files stuff tends to do it for me -- I think David does that humor especially well, and Gillian provides great contrast.

Re: The X-Files

It’s weird — while I disagree with Informant that romance for Mulder and Scully was wrong wrong wrong and also wrong, I am completely in agreement about how it affected the show. There’s a strange irony to how THE X-FILES avoided the Mulder/Scully romance for so long and yet stumbled face-first into every potential problem.

It was *very* awkward for the show to initiate a romantic arc in FIGHT THE FUTURE but to follow up in Season 6 with teases that would gradually fade away from Season 6 after the first 10 episodes and become intermittent rather than regular. Mulder and Scully were being plugged into one romcom situation after another but never got together for no adequately established reason onscreen.

Season 7 was also awkward. Mulder and Scully kissed on New Year’s Eve, yet there was no follow-up or exploration of the significance. The non-commital approach to the romance led to “all things” having to construct a lifelong struggle for Scully to then resolve in the same episode in order to start an offscreen romance with Mulder.

The ambiguity made it really hard for me, as a viewer, to track where the characters were and they often didn’t feel like people as much as shop window dummies being prodded back and forth without their own will driving the story.

Mulder wasn’t in most of Season 8, but when he returned, there was again an awkward ambiguity because the show refused to confirm if he were the father of Scully’s child (or if he thought himself the father). It wasn’t clear who Mulder and Scully were to each other at this point. Season 8 also suffered from an ill-advised retcon where Carter declared that Mulder had been slowly dying from a terminal illness during the entirety of Season 7 which didn’t track with Duchovny’s performance or the Season 7 scripts. The plot was instantly dismissed upon Duchovny’s return as a Season 8 regular and Scully never confronted Mulder onscreen about hiding his illness from her. There was no clarity regarding the relationship.

It was so confusing that even after Season 8 ended with Scully holding her child and Mulder kissing her, fans were unsure as to William’s parentage and Carter had to confirm in interviews that Mulder was the father (although he now says he planned all along that the Smoking Man impregnated Scully).

Season 9, despite Mulder’s absence from all of it except the finale, had Mulder writing ridiculously overwrought emails to Scully that had none of Mulder’s charm, sarcasm or wit. I WANT TO BELIEVE has the highest level of awkwardness with the film unwilling to confirm whether or not Mulder and Scully are even a couple for almost half the movie and then having a halfhearted breakup that is then ignored by the rest of the film.

“My Struggle” re-establishes them as amicable exes and that seemed to end the confusion — only for Season 11 to now indicate tremendous discord. Chris Carter writes them as platonic partners who’ve had a few evenings; Glen Morgan writes them as a common-law power couple; Darin Morgan writes them as dating but distant (what boyfriend doesn’t let his girlfriend know he’s going off to the woods?). It’s just baffling. It's one thing for the duo to vary in how much conflict they have from week to week, but being a couple in one episode and platonic the next is awkward. Informant’s right to say they shouldn’t have done it at all if they were going to do it in such a half-witted, unconsidered, uncommitted fashion.

Re: The X-Files

Setting aside all the political commentary, I don't think there's any doubt that Darin Morgan is skewering, mocking, criticizing and ultimately debunking Chris Carter's approach to the myth-arc whether it's Colonization, the Spartan Virus or William's true parentage. Carter has always permitted his writing staff to make fun of him with his blessing.

"Forehead Sweat" is composed entirely of people standing around talking in ominous foreshadowing, teasing grand payoffs that only come in the form of very sad anti-climaxes. Reggie Something offers a secret history behind the world we know only for his grand revelations to be exposed as a delusion. Dr. They is a silly figure of absurdity whose every statement underscores not a word should be taken seriously.

In addition, all the clues regarding Reggie's identity are contradictory and nonsensical: his ID appeared in the digitized X-Files records in "This" and Skinner recognizes him, he's being pursued by FBI agents and henchmen -- except given Scully's revelations, Reggie shouldn't be known to anyone save the orderlies at the Spotnitz Sanitarium.

Every time "Forehead Sweat" provides any sort of master narrative on disparate, disconnected and confusing events, the pieces fail to fit into a cohesive whole and Dr. They points out that there is so much trivia and information and theory that it's impossible to know what's true and what's not anymore.

This has always been the case with THE X-FILES specifically in terms of the alien conspiracy. The pieces have never fit together. Season 1 has the US government executing any and all alien life on sight for which Deep Throat expresses his deep regret -- except Season 2 indicates that aliens have infiltrated every level civilization and formed a shadow government.

Season 3 indicates that aliens are conducting rogue experiments in combining human and alien DNA and they're creating clone upon clone of Samantha, but Season 5 and FIGHT THE FUTURE declare it's actually the Syndicate trying to create an alien human hybrid so that the conspirators can... survive the alien invasion by... what? 
The black oil it its first appearance is merely a 'medium' for an alien life force to transfer its essence into a human host, but in its subsequent appearance, it becomes a virus designed to turn a human into an alien, but then later on, the black oil is in fact an alien life form that possesses and controls humans. What?

The bees are being used to spread the virus to exterminate human victims except the plan as revealed in FIGHT THE FUTURE is to use humans as a slave race, so the bees are for... what again? Season 6 at last explains that the invasion plot is for the black oil aliens to invade Earth and use human bodies as incubators to repopulate the planet with their offspring... so the bees are... what? And the clones are for... what?

THE X-FILES was composed of all these little clues thrown out randomly in separate episodes with a later episode attempting to impose a master narrative upon all these disparate hints except half of them don't fit the overarching story declared afterwards.

If Reggie Something is a delusional mental patient, how could Dr. They be a real person whom Mulder oculd meet? If the endgame of the myth-arc was ultimately the Spartan Virus as a a human-devised means of population control, why was there an alien bounty hunter killing off alien-human conspirators? If the Cigarette Smoking Man plotted his apocalyptic scenario from the start, why was he presented as middle management within the Syndicate in Seasons 1 - 6?

"Forehead Sweat" is noting the sheer futility of trying to make sense of any of this incoherence by deliberately offering a mini-myth-arc with miniature hints that add up to a miniature level of myth-arc meandering that leaves us none the wiser.

I liked it, although at times, I despaired at how long we were spending in that parking lot.

Re: The X-Files

The parking garage was funny, if only because the show has always spent a great deal of time in parking garages. And having Mulder's super secret meeting spot be the FBI garage was kinda funny. He's gotten that lazy in his old age. smile

Please be informed that the political, scientific, sociological, economic and legal views expressed in Informant's posts and social media accounts do not reflect any consensus of Sliders.tv.

Re: The X-Files

Mulder ranting at the young FBI agents was hilarious to me on account of how Mulder is bragging about his conspiracy credentials when he spent Seasons 1 - 9 investigating a plot to invade Earth that turned out to be a hoax and he failed to ever expose the conspirators at all. It seems to me that aside from being gainfully employed by the FBI for a career spanning three decades (with six years as a federal fugitive and nine years doing nothing), Mulder has no meaningful achievements whatsoever, something Darin Morgan has always been keen to highlight.

One of my favourite X-FILES websites, www.EattheCorn.com, spent almost the entire length of the show documenting the myth-arc across the nine seasons, two films and then the Season 10 & 11 comic books. The webmaster was dismayed when Chris Carter declared the bulk of the myth-arc to be a hoax in “My Struggle,” attempted to reconcile alien colonization with the Spartan Virus in “My Struggle II” and gave up halfway into his review.

With “My Struggle III,” however, Eat the Corn seemed to squeal with delight at two lines of dialogue where Mr. Y declares that he was part of a Syndicate to bring about alien colonization but that it’s not happening due to environmental damage. The webmaster was later gushing on Facebook about how pleased he was that the Season 1 - 9 myth-arc was validated by these two lines. He then suggested a new approach to the myth-arc with Seasons 1 - 9 being genuine but the colonization aborted some time between 2000 and 2012 with the Spartan Virus being a new conspiracy that was devised colonization was cancelled.

I thought it was hilarious how passionate he became over Chris Carter throwing him a bone in this fashion when to me, it was very grudging and dismissive. And, to me, “Forehead Sweat” is a (gentle) way of mocking fans like the Eat the Corn webmaster who are trying to make sense of it all when the people pumping out this information have no concern for sense whatsover.

(But we’re all crazy passionate about silly things; I’m ridiculous with SLIDERS and I think this gentleman is my X-FILES counterpart.)

Re: The X-Files

I really enjoyed this episode.  I thought it was a ton of fun....particularly when Reggie was re-edited into the opening credits and clips from the show.  I thought the actor that played Reggie had great comedic timing and played the part perfectly.

The scene with They and Mulder was played with this fun, surreal quality, and I think the whole Mandela/Mengele Effect was played wonderfully.  It's strange that the best two episodes of the revival (IMO) have been, basically, straight-up comedies, but it's really worked for them when they've gone for it.

Re: The X-Files

To me, Dr. They's remark about how we are all deluged in so much information we don't know whether or not to believe anything at all -- it's a comment on the mythology where between Colonization, Sveta, the Spartan Virus and William's parentage, the myth-arc has gone back and forth upon itself so many times that the viewer is completely lost as to what to believe. Dr. They also declares that in this post-conspiracy/post-cover-up era, Mulder search for truth has become irrelevant and Darin Morgan is by extension calling THE X-FILES redundant and out of date.

I'm not sure I agree with that. I think that the myth-arc is most definitely out of touch with modern concerns and Chris Carter's efforts to update it broke continuity and also presented some truly hamfisted and inane storytelling. THE X-FILES no longer works when it's about two FBI agents trying to break open a conspiracy that keeps morphing into a new form that's in stark contradiction to its previous incarnation with an alien invasion becoming a means of population control becoming something about supersoldier infants. Jesus.

But. I think that THE X-FILES is highly effective as a paranormal procedural about a skeptic and an investigator delving into mysteries of a supernatural or science fiction nature in a world that is more or less our own. That's a concept that continued to thrive long after THE X-FILES went off the air. It flourished with FRINGE, it was a success with SUPERNATURAL. Monsters of the week is a good format.

The fixation on the myth-arc has created a lot of bizarre characterization because the show seems uncomfortable with having the characters note that Colonization and the Spartan Virus are two contradictory conspiracies. Mulder confronted the Smoking Man in "My Struggle II" and didn't remark once upon how CGB Spender made him waste at least nine years investigating a phony invasion plot, he later visits Deep Throat's grave and doesn't wonder if Ronald tricked him into believing in Colonization or if he was pawn as well.

THE X-FILES still has value as a paranormal procedural, but the myth-arc is past its sell-by date. I take no pleasure in saying that, however. I understand that a lot of fans have a lot of fondness and devotion to it. I respect that -- I just don't share it.

Re: The X-Files

They probably should have resolved the alien/Samantha arc around season 4, and introduced a new mythology to move forward. Say season 5 has Mulder digging into the disappearance of a remote viewer who worked with the government in the 1950s. This leads to the revelation that there have been more disappearances. This leads to Mulder realizing that he always seems to be one step behind in his pursuit of answers, which leads him to question whether the missing people are victims or some sort of new threat.

Or something. Basically, pivot toward a new conspiracy. It's not like the world is short on them. Or maybe have Scully take the lead this time.

Please be informed that the political, scientific, sociological, economic and legal views expressed in Informant's posts and social media accounts do not reflect any consensus of Sliders.tv.

Re: The X-Files

Oh and BTW, I'm also a little tired of the Trump jabs.  If Fox is so pissed off about Trump, why doesn't he spend his time trying to investigate him?  He's already free, apparently, to do whatever he wants.

I get that Hollywood doesn't love Trump and wants to pat themselves on the back for speaking out to millions of people, but it really dates the show.  He's going to be out of office before we know it, and these little comments are going to look so petty one day.

Re: The X-Files

They are already pretty dated and petty, and they just aired! The problem with a lot of these hollow jabs is that they're based on "everybody knows..." politics. They're not based on facts or reality, just raw emotion, with vague references to news headlines that nobody bothered to read the story for. So now we have Mulder making comments about the President wanting to shut down the FBI (not something that I think is true), and we're at a point in the news cycle where shutting down the FBI doesn't sound like the craziest idea in the world... which again, will probably change before the story is settled.

And it was done in such a way where Mulder and Scully are wondering what they'll do if they lose their jobs... the jobs that they just got back, after spending 13 years without those jobs!

The need to jab at Trump has trumped (no pun intended) the need for their stories to make sense. We're expected to laugh because "everybody knows" that what they're saying is true, because it bashed Trump.


Argh.

Please be informed that the political, scientific, sociological, economic and legal views expressed in Informant's posts and social media accounts do not reflect any consensus of Sliders.tv.

Re: The X-Files

Well, even putting aside any part of whether or not it's true, it's just a weird thing to put in there.  Because let's assume that Trump *doesn't* shut down the FBI, and let's assume that he either has one term or gets out before one term. 

The jokes are gonna be weird and irrelevant in just a couple of years.  If you tried to watch it in a few years, you'd wonder if you missed some segment of the X-Files where the President was involved.  Because these jokes are really only relevant now.

I think "fake news" and media/government propaganda belongs on the X-Files because they're constantly dealing with misinformation.  Having Mulder say something in one episode or two might be a clever little wink to the audience, but the show is doing it over and over again.  And while they might have something to say now, Trump is a very temporary problem.  It'd be like if every single episode of the Simpsons' first few seasons had a Dan Quayle joke.  It's just weird.

Re: The X-Files

Agreed. It'd be like if any show ever had an Obama joke... Ever.

Good thing that never happened. smile

Please be informed that the political, scientific, sociological, economic and legal views expressed in Informant's posts and social media accounts do not reflect any consensus of Sliders.tv.

Re: The X-Files

I feel like you guys don't really get THE X-FILES although that could be said of pretty much everyone who has ever written for the show as they were encouraged to do STEPHEN KING's X-FILES/DARIN MORGAN's X-FILES/________'s X-FILES rather than aim for any sort of house style. Across 11 seasons and two films, however, the show has always been set *now*. Not in the past, not in the future, not in a parallel reality -- so the modern day references are how the show has been.

In the 90s, the anxieties were about cyberspace, tobacco, faith healers, the space program, AIDS, human trafficking, Indigenous peoples and government cover-ups. It's part of why the endgame of Colonization always seemed so unbelievable. THE X-FILES is set in our world and it will always have more continuity with reality than with its own episodes. 90s era X-FILES is dated by the fashions and the cell phones, 2015+ X-FILES is dated by its politics and that's every TV show that was ever made.

But it's pretty fair to dislike the jokes if you feel they don't work. That's valid criticism.

Re: The X-Files

It's weird -- I liked Season 10 of THE X-FILES. It often wasn't *good,* but not for lack of trying, if that makes any sense. I had accepted somewhere around 1998 that THE X-FILES would only ever offer an anti-climax to its alien mythology. I enjoyed how "My Struggle" didn't recapture the plot, but it recaptured the atmosphere: brooding conversations and ambiguity and mystery. I enjoyed how "My Struggle" dismissed the old conspiracy and declared it a smokescreen for a new one more in tune with 21st century threats.

When Mulder says that Colonization was him "being led by my nose through a dark alley to a dead end," it didn't fit the show's continuity -- but it had a ring of real-world truth about how the myth-arc was never going anywhere. I liked that and I liked how how "My Struggle II" brought about a version of Colonization in a human-driven, viral form suited to the procedural paranoia of THE X-FILES.

But then Season 11 came and it wimped out terribly. Rather than let the conclusion of "My Struggle II" stand (Colonization came, Scully found a cure) and use the time gap to wrap up the cliffhanger (say the cure was distributed between Season 10 and Season 11 and move on, focus on monsters of the week and characterization), Chris Carter again tried to artificially extend a plot that's completely out of content with William's parentage.

Now I'm rewatching Season 10 and... the flaws that seemed excusable in the name of wrapping up THE X-FILES' storyline years too late are no longer excusable because there's been no wrap up.

*sigh*

Re: The X-Files

I loved seeing Stuart Margolin on screen once again, as a big Rockford Files fan!  The Trump jokes are dumb, but I think they do them because DJT and many of this followers spout all kinds of conspiracies.  Trump promised to released docs from JFK and UFO's, too, which were duds.

Re: The X-Files

I think it'd be fine if Mulder made a sarcastic comment or whatever, but they just keep hammering it, and it's frustrating. Mostly because they aren't clever comments, they're just actively insulting their audience in petty ways. I make Trump jokes all the time, so I'm not really defensive of him. It's just done really poorly. I think the original series is still watchable because while it is very dated in some ways, they didn't go out of their way to date it over and over again in every episode.

It just comes down to bad decision-making in general.

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Re: The X-Files

This week's episode was weak. It wasn't as horrible as the first two of the season, but it was incredibly weak. It was like they took a typical X-File monster of the week story and tried to turn it into a story about William, and the final product was neither one of those things. It didn't have the weight or care of an episode about William should have, even with the weird scene with Scully crying over his body. They didn't spend enough time getting to the "this is William" side of the story, and the fact that whole thing just came to them, rather than them going to it, made it feel false.

Had they played the angle of Scully finding the file on Mulder's desk, and her suspecting/projecting a William angle over their course of the investigation, the episode could have been really interesting. It didn't even need to be the real William. In fact, it probably shouldn't have been, because turning him into this big X-File creature with super powers prevents him from being an active part of the story in any real way.

Trying to mash these stories together deprived the story of any natural flow. It just didn't work for me.

On another note, what's with Gillian Anderson's voice? I watch her on The Fall and American Gods, and she sounds perfectly normal. However, on The X-Files, she sounds like she's spent the last 15 years living with the Cigarette Smoking Man.

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Re: The X-Files

I wonder if the Vancouver air just doesn't agree with her throat.

**

I feel like Informant's issue with this week's episode of THE X-FILES is that it's an episode of THE X-FILES and THE X-FILES isn't for everyone. Even I don't really like it; I don't enjoy it as much as I study it. If I want a show with strong continuity, ongoing character progression and logical links to previously established concepts that avoids an anthology approach, I'd watch FRINGE. (I might do that anyway.)

THE X-FILES is fundamentally about absence, loss and the search for that which is missing. The Pilot was centered around missing time. Writer/directors Glen Morgan and James Wong left THE X-FILES after Season 4, came back for Season 10, watched Seasons 5 - 9 and declared that William could under no circumstances be brushed off as easily as Season 9 seemed to suggest. So, James Wong presents "Ghouli" in which Mulder and Scully search for their missing son and are met with absence and loss at every turn. By the time they find William, he's a corpse and his story is over. Scully gets her worst nightmare to come true: sending William away only made him troubled and damaged and monstrous. And when she gets her reunion with William, she only finds out about it after the fact. That's THE X-FILES.

THE X-FILES is also very focused on ambiguity. William has two girlfriends; is it because he's a lying, cheating player or is he polyamorous but struggling to understand his sexual identity? William induces his two girlfriends to attack each other; does he truly have no regard for human life or was he trying to master his powers and racing the clock against the Spartan Virus?

There's also tremendous ambivalence with regards to continuity. In Season 9, Spender injected William with magnetite that should have negated his powers; this is ignored. Season 9 also established that Scully's abduction had tampered with her physiology and that William would benefit from alien DNA -- but Season 11 now declares that it wasn't about aliens but instead supersoldiers as part of Project Crossroads, an awkward retcon that goes undiscussed and James Wong carefully scripts the story to acknowledge the myth-arc but sail right past the discrepancy.

Deliberate anti-climaxes, cautious ambiguity, unclear continuity -- that's THE X-FILES. For better or for worse. (Informant could be right to say it's worse.)

Re: The X-Files

No, I'm an X-Files fan. I started watching the show when the first episode aired, and I have watched it straight through today. Ice rewstched the series. I know the series. I get the series. I know what it's like when it's good, and I know what it's like when it's not. Sorry, but if you watch the series all the way through (including the rather iffy last couple seasons of the original run) and go right I to this revival, it just doesn't feel like it fits (for the most part). "Ghouli" is a halfway good stand-alone episode and a halfway good mythology episode, but ultimately succeeds at being neither. And the lack of proper story construction is perfectly evident in the scene in Mulder's office. The case is introduced as both a normal X-File and as a supernatural message to Scully, when only one of those was needed (probably the supernatural element, because it would echo Scully's previous discovery of her daughter)


A fun experiment might be to go back and watch the introduction of Emily in season 5.

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Re: The X-Files

I think Season 8 is one of the show's best years. Season 9 was bad.

Re: The X-Files

There's another continuity peculiarity -- William was adopted by Wyoming farmers in Season 9. But in Season 11, they're now a wealthy Virginia family. Ah, continuity. Doesn't exist on this show.

Re: The X-Files

I'm torn. I agree that season 9 was pretty bad, but I also like the Doggett and Reyes characters and don't like it when people lump them in with the show's downfall. Honestly, I think the show lost a lot of it's vibe when it moved to California. They still had good episodes, but it just felt wrong to go from gray and rainy, to bright and sunny.

Season 9 had an episode called "4D", which featured parallel worlds, and it was done in an interesting way. I'd be interested in seeing an episode where the Mulder and Scully from the revival meet their alternates, from a world where they are 100% platonic. I just want to see the look on that Scully's face. smile

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Re: The X-Files

Season 8 was very strong as THE X-FILES committed fully to serialization, something it had declined to engage in despite being the first show to attempt an ongoing mythology over multiple episodes and seasons. Season 9 suffered badly because Mulder was inexplicably made the center of the show despite the actor refusing to return and there was also a lot of awkward scripting to include Scully in stories because they had the actress on contract but didn't have anything for her to do.

**

I don't think we need anymore standalones where William is represented through a surrogate (Christian in I WANT TO BELIEVE, the genetically altered children in "Founders Mutation," the trash man monster in "Home Again"). It was time for William to step back into the story and James Wong made it happen albeit in that classic X-FILES fashion of being elusive and always out of reach, much like Samantha and the truth behind the conspiracy.

Re: The X-Files

It's fine for William to be brought back into the picture. I just think that the execution of that story was poor. It felt like a generic X-Files script, with scenes added to put William in there, but without properly framing that side of the story.

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Re: The X-Files

Personally, I would have preferred William join the cast from this episode onwards. But I've come to accept that the show has a house format (as opposed to style) that isn't ever going to change. It would bother me if not for SUPERNATURAL and FRINGE having pursued the ongoing development that TXF just won't ever do.

Re: The X-Files

Yeah. I guess it is what it is. As a whole, I can't really view this revival as part of the larger X-Files series. Some of the episodes, sure, but not all of them. So at best, maybe it's a glimpse into the X-Files multiverse where different episodes take place in canon and some don't, leaving it up to the viewer to decide which is which.

While I'm watching the show this year, I have some family members who have watched everything up to this point, but just couldn't do it anymore. So now I'm going to just tell them which ones are worth their time and which aren't.

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Re: The X-Files

It’s funny how THE X-FILES comic books, the SEASON 10 - 11 series, were originally billed as a canonical conitnuation of the series. Chris Carter, who did little more than read the comic book scripts, had his name put on the covers. The publisher understood that Carter’s name at the top of the credits lent the comics a credibility among fans that was instantly lost the second THE X-FILES was announced as returning to TV.

SEASON 11 ends with Mulder confronting an alien ship that warps spacetime in order to traverse great distances. A rip in reality shows glimpses of parallel universes — one of which shows Mulder and Scully in their “My Struggle” outfits: Mulder with his sunglasses and green jacket, Scully with her parted down the center hair. The implication was that SEASONS 10 - 11 were in a parallel universe to the Revival — except that given the Revival’s liberties with the myth-arc and continuity, the actual effect upon readers (or at least me) was that the comics were canon and it was the Revival that was set in a parallel universe to the original TV show.

The televised Season 11 seems determined to pepper every episode with the theme of alternate realities whether they are visions (“My Struggle III”), computer simulations (“This”), perceptions through multiple personalities (“Plus One”), false memories (“Forehead Sweat”) and telepathic illusions (“Ghouli”).

**

In terms of the downfall of THE X-FILES as a cultural force — this is strictly my opinion, but Seasons 2 - 5 were the height of the show in terms of ratings. After the movie, the ratings started to fall. My suspicion is that the Mulder/Scully case-of-the-week format with occasional myth-arc episodes was effective for five years. After five seasons, however, the audience craved a new take. FIGHT THE FUTURE suggested that there would indeed be a new emphasis on the Mulder-Scully relationship and the myth-arc where Seasons 1 -  5 hadn’t really done character arcs or developed the myth-arc all that much.

Season 6, however, didn’t deliver. There was a lot of teasing for both the Mulder-Scully relationship and the myth-arc, but there was nothing concerete. The romcom episodes came to an end without any real changes. The “Two Fathers”/One Son” revealed the mythology and killed off the Syndicate, but the aliens were still coming and the Smoking Man carried on his plotting, so nothing had really changed. Speculatively, I wonder if “Two Fathers”/“One Son” made it clear that both the relationship and the myth-arc would only ever be teases and doubletalk and the audience gave up.

Later shows like HOUSE and BUFFY were careful: each season had a year-long myth-arc that would be resolved by the season’s end. Each year also had some revisions to the format. As David Shore (HOUSE) would remark, you want to be making little changes to the show before the audience starts asking for them as opposed to after they’ve gotten bored — and you maybe want to commit to the changes wholeheartedly instead of in the wishy-washy fashion THE X-FILES did. That said, Informant would not agree with commiting fully and totally to a Mulder-Scully romance...

Personally, I would have had FIGHT THE FUTURE be the climactic, widescreen action conclusion to the alien invasion arc — and it ends with the X-Files Division burned to the ground and Mulder and Scully banned from the FBI premises for life. Season 6 ends with Mulder working at a tabloid and Scully working at a blood bank — until the Lone Gunmen call. Frohike won the lottery. Frohike wants to expand the Lone Gunmen into a national enterprise of exploring paranormal events — and he wants to re-name the magazine THE X-FILES and he wants Mulder and Scully to be his lead investigators. Season 6 starts a more ensemble approach where it’s now Mulder, Scully, Langley, Frohike, Byers and then it widens to include Jeffrey Spender, Diana Fowley and then it turns out that Frohike didn’t actually win the lottery, but the Smoking Man staged it...

With Season 7, I would have THE X-FILES go global with Mulder and Scully mentoring trainees as a new generation of X-Files investigators. With Season 8, Mulder goes missing and we focus on Scully and the trainees. With Season 9, Gillian Anderson is at last released from her contract and the trainees take center stage, shepherded by FBI agents Reyes and Doggett who have been made liaisons as the FBI consult with the X-Files Magazine.

TV works best when the concept evolves a bit each year. THE X-FILES refused to grow. It’s still refusing to grow.

Re: The X-Files

So glad to see Chris Carter fighting back on the calls to close out the series just because Gillian is done
http://www.digitalspy.com/tv/the-x-file … -anderson/

I'm not sure how FOX will feel though. That's the irony here.  The ratings have been just above average and this show isn't cheap.

Re: The X-Files

I sometimes think THE X-FILES might have been better as a low-rated, low-budgeted cult series that muddled along, always drawing in slightly more ad revenue than it cost to actually make it, supported by a legion of diehard fans and largely ignored by the general public. Like FRINGE! Like SUPERNATURAL! Except the fate of cult shows in the 90s was, well, pretty much what we saw with SLIDERS: a slow death by a thousand cuts with endless retooling and recasting until the fanbase was reduced to six people and the ending to the series was scripted by the fanbase's village mental patient (twice over).

233 (edited by RussianCabbie_Lotteryfan 2018-02-05 20:56:18)

Re: The X-Files

That's true, in the 90s there wasn't so much room for niche stuff.  At least compared to now.  But yea, Supernatural would be a good model.  Though hard to complain with 11 seasons.  And hopefully more.  That said, it seems like a lot of the public has dropped off of X Files for whatever season.  Season 10 just didn't appeal to them and I guess the premiere episode this year didn't help. It's not doing bad for a show, but for what it is, not impressive.

Re: The X-Files

Keep in mind, the streaming option is becoming more and more popular all the time. The normal ratings hardly seem relevant anymore. (and I say this as someone who fully understands why the ratings should drop like a rock)

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Re: The X-Files

Informant wrote:

Keep in mind, the streaming option is becoming more and more popular all the time. The normal ratings hardly seem relevant anymore. (and I say this as someone who fully understands why the ratings should drop like a rock)

Oh yea, I fully understand that. I'm really just looking at it compared to the new norm. That said, I'm sure the DVR is pretty decent for the show. Here's the live ratings:

https://tvseriesfinale.com/tv-show/x-fi … ni-series/

https://tvseriesfinale.com/tv-show/fox- … n-ratings/

Re: The X-Files

Not bad this week. A standard X-File, with an interesting plot. Leaning a little much on the trope of the psycho US army dude in Vietnam, but adding a government conspiracy to explain it. The episode was shot well, and the characters were written well enough, for the most part. So yeah, not bad.


Question, going back to the politics of this season: these episodes take place shortly after My Struggle II, right? So we'd be in maybe April of 2016 by now? So there is no President Trump yet. I guess they're fudging the dates so they don't end up making a period piece when all is said and done, but this is a great reason why they shouldn't be doing political commentary.

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Re: The X-Files

Informant wrote:

Question, going back to the politics of this season: these episodes take place shortly after My Struggle II, right? So we'd be in maybe April of 2016 by now? So there is no President Trump yet. I guess they're fudging the dates so they don't end up making a period piece when all is said and done, but this is a great reason why they shouldn't be doing political commentary.

Mr. Robot did a similar thing.  Their show definitely takes place in 2016, but they're making one of the plotlines about political maneuvering to get a guy like Trump in the White House.  Then there's one scene where a big time player is watching a Trump rally or speech.

I get that Hollywood hates him, and they feel like they're doing their form of protest.  But I don't really see the point of hitting us so hard with it.  I don't like him either, but I don't bring it up all the time at my work.

Re: The X-Files

Yeah, it's selfish writing, when the writer becomes more important than the characters or stories. (Which is not the same thing as setting out to tell a political or personal story in the first place)

Similarly, with the Arrowverse, we've seen them make references to Trump, but they've clearly established their own fictional presidents, so it makes no sense.

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Re: The X-Files

"Kitten" seems to think THE X-FILES is a more modern series than it's been. If Skinner had featured prominently in Season 11 doing questionable things for the first five episodes, "Kitten" would have been a midpoint in his arc where Mulder and Scully realize that while they don't know what Skinner's doing with the Smoking Man, they can trust it's for their benefit.

But what's actually happened: Mulder and Scully stopped trusting Skinner in "My Struggle III" for vague reasons (he smelled like smoke), but have continued to use him as a plot and expository device for brief guest-roles with no real progress or development. "Kitten" then has Skinner explain his attitude to authority -- but Mulder and Scully inexplicably don't demand an explanation as to his recent collaboration with CGB Spender.

It's awkward. The best way to handle this plot and keep THE X-FILES' preferred standalone concept: Mulder should never have been suspicious of Skinner. Skinner's partnership with Spender should have been known to the audience but not Mulder -- and then this episode could serve as a clarification of Skinner's loyalties to the audience.

As aired, this conflict demands ongoing development. What we're getting instead is the characters alluding to Skinner's allegiances, then ignoring it. It doesn't affect the story and its presence is therefore deeply distracting.

A modern series would have had Skinner and the Smoking Man working together in an ongoing arc (like Castiel and Crowley did on SUPERNATURAL) and then built to a confrontation where Mulder and Scully find out (like where Sam, Dean and Bobby set a trap for Castiel to expose him) and either sever ties or choose to trust him. Instead, the arc has just clumsily meandered in a half-alive state; we're told that Skinner may be compromised, but he's wheeled out to give Mulder and Scully information in "This," for a joke in "Forehead" and for more exposition in "Ghouli."

Due to the standalone format, "Kitten" isn't permitted to make any advancement in Skinner's arc. It just reiterates that Skinner was in Vietnam and learned not to trust authority. We already got this information in 1996; "Kitten" reveals absolutely nothing new about Skinner, lends no insight whatsoever and the most critical aspect of Skinner's life -- his role with the Smoking Man -- isn't addressed.

The reappearance of FBI Deputy Director Alvin Kersh is another awkward note of continuity. His presence raises so many unanswered questions. He was consistently sabotaging Mulder and Scully in Seasons 6 - 9, but then in the Season 9 finale, he helped Mulder escape from jail. Did Kersh believe in Colonization? Or was he led to believe that Mulder and Scully were a disciplinary issue? Was he working for the Syndicate or was he making the best choices he could when managing Mulder, a talented agent who was considered insane? Was he genuinely hostile towards Mulder, Scully and Doggett or was it an act? He shows up in "Kitten" and all that's expressed is that he finds Mulder and Scully annoying and considers them the reason Skinner's career at the FBI stalled.

This raises some serious questions that "Kitten" in its standalone format can't address. Why were the X-Files reopened? "My Struggle" didn't address it, simply having Skinner text Mulder and Scully to say, "Situation critical, need to see you ASAP" and the following week had Mulder and Scully back in the office. If Kersh thinks so poorly of Mulder and Scully, why did he permit them to be reinstated to the FBI? Would it really have been difficult for Kersh (who outranks Skinner) to refuse to see two former federal fugitives cleared for duty a good 15 years since they quit and were fired? Why would Kersh, who came to Mulder's side by the end of Season 9, derisively call Mulder's truth "imaginary"?

THE X-FILES is just not on the ball with characterization. And in fact, Mitch Pileggi did an interview where he described how the "My Struggle III" script had Mulder smelling smoke on Skinner and throwing a punch leading to an intense fight scene. But Duchovny and Pileggi protested: their characters had been friends for two decades and Carter, rather than rewrite the scene, toned it down to the silly shoving between the two that aired. It's a bad situation when the creator of the show writes a fight scene between two friends for no good reason whatsoever.

THE X-FILES has all of its writers working separately, the showrunner is not overseeing ongoing progression and episode-to-episode consistency and "Kitten" suffers like no other episode aired this year due to these issues.

Re: The X-Files

I agree with all of that, but didn't they have a lot of those issues with the Skinner character throughout the series?

It's weird that the show isn't pretending that Mulder and Scully have been working for the FBI for all of these years, but they're still acting as though they have been. They wonder what they'll do if they lose their jobs. They are blamed for Skinner's career going nowhere for all these years. It's strange.

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Re: The X-Files

I think that Skinner collaborating with the Syndicate while helping Mulder and Scully was less of a problem in Seasons 1 - 6 because he appeared more often and, because Mulder and Scully were at a distance from him until Season 7, the ambiguity surrounding him made sense.

But what made sense when Mulder and Scully had only known Skinner for 1 - 6 years makes no sense when they've known him for a quarter of a century, especially he helped Mulder break out of jail in "The Truth," came Mulder's rescue in I WANT TO BELIEVE, and reinstated Mulder and Scully in "My Struggle."

The EatTheCorn.com webmaster messaged me this morning asking me if I had any way of reconciling Kersh's appearance in "Kitten" with his Season 6 - 9 character arc. It's a sad day when *the* X-FILES expert comes to ME for help. "Kitten" broke him.

Re: The X-Files

One thing we should remember is that I would hazard to bet a LARGE segment of the current XF audience may well not recall the first series!  I certainly barely remember the details!

Re: The X-Files

That's fair enough. But a revival (particularly that in a genre like this, with hardcore followings) should take more care in how they do things. Roseanne can get away with pretending that large chunks of the original show never happened. The X-Files has a harder time doing that.

Kersh is a problem, but I am far more upset at what they've done with Reyes. It's cruel and careless, and I just don't buy Reyes as being CSM's minion.

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Re: The X-Files

Can we just assume, sorta like the Sliders theory, that every episode of the show is hypothetically a different Mulder and Scully from a different parallel universe?

Re: The X-Files

Didn't we already have this conversation when talking about "This"?

Re: The X-Files

However many times it's said, I'm just happy if we can all agree to just go with it. smile

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Re: The X-Files

And I am happy to swoop into X-Files fandom at the tail end and assume a massive role of importance after all the previously important fans gave up and moved on with their lives,

Re: The X-Files

This week was obviously inspired by Black Mirror and its theme of technology going wrong. Not an original concept for The X-Files.

The episode wasn't horrible. It definitely kept my interest, but there were a couple of things that kept it from being a really good X-Files episode.

For starters, there was no X-File. Once again, the drama came to Mulder and Scully, ignoring the central structure of the show. The story would have worked better with them going to investigate a weird death before this all happened to them. As it stands, these characters didn't even have to be Mulder and Scully. Swap out any unfamiliar characters, and the episode remains pretty much the same.

Another thing was that the episode pushed beyond the subtle, creepy theme of technology attacking them, and just went too far with how these attacks took place, as though the writers felt a need to create action where a more subtle attack would have worked better.

And neither Mulder nor Scully seem particularly surprised by any of this crazy tech. I know that we live in the future and our tech is crazy, but we're not quite to the point where I'd come home from a robot restaurant, in my driverless cars, only to have my house try to kill me, all without being a little wowed by it all.

I liked the theme of the episode. I think the idea itself works, and it is fun to see Mulder and Scully at the center of this story. I could have done without the vibrator gag, not because I'm a prude, but because I am far less likely to sit down with my mother to watch this episode at any point.

It wasn't as bad as some of the episodes this year, but it definitely could have used some revisions.

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Re: The X-Files

I felt like the episode was 100% a case of ireactions' theory on the X-Files.  This was just a writer/writers being given the X-Files sandbox and being allowed to do whatever they want with it.  This episode took place at some point in the future where technology is more advanced than it is now, and this is one of their stories.

I loved it.

I don't only think it was one of the best episodes of X-Files I've seen in a while.  I legitimately think it was one of my favorite episodes of any TV show that I've seen recently.  It was far-fetched (AI team up to kill the guy that won't tip his robot chef), but it was thrilling and engrossing and a whole lot of fun.  It could've easily been an episode of Black Mirror, but the fact that it was Mulder and Scully made it that much better.  It's these two legends of TV, brought back into the modern time, and now they have to deal with this Black Mirror scenario.

So many things were effective.  I thought, for the first part, that Mulder and Scully wouldn't speak the whole episode.  That only the AI would speak.  The silent movie effect was still powerful.  And the cold, alien, lifeless setting of the rest of the episode made the final scene in the full-of-life diner so much livelier. 

I'm not kidding.  I absolutely loved it.

Re: The X-Files

I hate that it was an episode that involved two dead kids, but this week's episode was probably the best of the season, and of the revival as a whole. It remembered what the show is, and who the characters are. The episode reminded me of other occult episodes of the show, but didn't just copy and paste elements, as some revival episodes have done.

They even managed to throw in cultural commentary that wasn't delivered with a sledgehammer to the head, or acts of political contortion that could be their own circus act.

No forced romance. A few light moments mixed in with the severely grim story (Mulder's "I did not see that coming" line made me laugh). This is the X-Files that I grew up with!

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Re: The X-Files

I'm caught up again!  The crazy AI episode was really funny, and quite creative.  Really harkened back to the old days.  As for the Familiar episode, yes, well done, but also I think a bit too Supernatural!

Re: The X-Files

THE X-FILES was the first show I ever saw where small children were acceptable victims of the week. It really disturbed me and I don't really know what to say about it. SMALLVILLE also really troubled me with the way it casually massacred teenagers (even if they were played by actors in their late 20s).

My main problem with the X-FILES formula for monsters of the week: Mulder and Scully never accomplish anything. Had they not appeared, the story would have unfolded in much the same way. THE X-FILES does it deliberately to represent how our world is at the mercy of inhuman, unknowable and otherworldly forces whether they're technologically advanced aliens or supernatural beings. It's not something I enjoy.

I don't really feel comfortable saying whether "Familiar" was good or bad except to say I don't really like THE X-FILES, I never have, I study it rather than enjoy it and it always makes me appreciate FRINGE.

With FRINGE, the victims of the week are played for tragedy and grief, but their deaths also lead Fringe Division to preventing further bloodshed and loss of life with every case-of-the-week building to the Season 5 finale in which Fringe Division saved the entire human race.

In every FRINGE episode, there is a scientific explanation. Sometimes, that science is absurd emotionalism masquerading as empirical analysis, but the show is commited to something resembling rationalism whereas THE X-FILES is an abstract horror show one week and a technology driven thriller the next and the lead characters are helpless. That's not what I personally want to see.

I will never say that THE X-FILES is a bad show, but it's not *my* show. No thank you. I'll watch it. I'll study it. I'll never buy DVD sets to revisit its narrative. I'll never like it and I'll never write a six part series of screenplays for it.

But people should be free to create work that I don't like.

Re: The X-Files

One of the reasons that I dislike Stephen King as a writer is his tendency to do horrible things to children. I find his habit to be gross, and cheap (I feel the same way about some of his other habits... I just don't like him).

That said, I'm not opposed to using kids in stories like this, as long as it doesn't feel cheap.

But yeah, I know what you mean about appreciating something as a story, or art, without necessarily enjoying it or liking it. The Passion of the Christ is like that for me. Beautiful movie all around. Deserved all the awards that it didn't get. However, it is incredibly difficult to watch (as well it should be).

I guess this week's episode of The X-Files marks the end of the season, since next week is a Chris Carter mythology episode, so I feel safe in assuming that it will suck.

And this week was... Weak.  "Nothing Lasts Forever" was a directionless mess of an episode. The writer obviously didn't know if it was the story of a cult, an actress feeding off of humans in order to remain young, a Frankenstein-ish mad scientist, a Buffy-like action hero, or Scully-religious-something-blahblahblah. And failing to tell one story resulted in a failure to tell all of these stories. And then we end with the old "mysterious whispered secret" trope, which rarely works. We might as well have had a slow motion shot of a coin being tossed into a fountain.

It frustrates me how easily this show could be great, if only someone would run it.

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254 (edited by RussianCabbie_Lotteryfan 2018-03-15 21:13:07)

Re: The X-Files

I've enjoyed this season.  Not having much in the way of season arcs has been felt but I think there's been a lot of creativity.

I know Gillian is done but I think they should have her as a non-field agent in the future.  Skinner type.  Assuming the ratings are good enough for FOX to want to spend the required budget of this series.

Re: The X-Files

They probably should have anticipated Anderson an Duchovny wanting less to do with to do with the series going forward, if the network wanted to keep it around at all. They had those other agents last season, but they were pretty much joke characters, too similar to Mulder and Scully. They should have established new agents that Mulder and Scully could work with and train. Perhaps even someone who had been part of an X-File as a child, back in the 90's. Even better if we know the character from an old episode.

This is also something that Supernatural should be doing, but they insist on killing off every human character who could possibly become a major recurring character.

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Re: The X-Files

Casting is super duper hard for younger agents.  But if you can do it, you have a shot.

There is something like 300-400 scripted series on tv nowadays, far less than when David and Gillian were cast, so getting top talent is a bigger challenge.  Though it looks like the X-Files budget is pretty high. I'm really impressed with the amount of locations, etc, they have had in recent episodes.

Re: The X-Files

My Struggle, Part 153...

...

...

Sigh

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Re: The X-Files

I haven't seen the finale, but I watched the penultimate episode (catching up from missing everything the week of my Honeymoon).  Alan Sepinwall says that it would've made a great finale, and I agree.  It definitely feels like the end of the Mulder and Scully adventures.  I don't know if it plays into the final My Struggle, but I could've easily seen that be the end.

One question I have - Duchovny seems really wooden this year.  I can't tell if he doesn't care or if he's just gotten bad at acting, but it just seems like he's reading his lines.  There doesn't seem to be much emotion behind them.  A lot of people claimed he was checked out last season, but this one seems just as bad (or worse).  Has anyone else thought that?  I think Gillian has been great, but Duchovny seems really out of it.  I know he's a good actor because I've seen it before.

Re: The X-Files

I think the acting comes and goes, for both of them, depending on the material. There have been moments when I really felt Mulder back on the screen, but I agree that he's really wooden at times. And it sometimes comes across as an age thing to me. He seems tired and old, and at times it seems like his face isn't even capable of moving in the ways that it once did.

But I have issues with Anderson's performance too, at times.

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Re: The X-Files

loved the finale!

(agree on david, gillian imo has been better, but that's over now).

Re: The X-Files

"Nothing Lasts Forever" and "My Struggle IV," despite being written by two different writers, seemed to have the same writing style: both Karen Nielsen and Chris Carter write scenes and moments instead of stories. In "Nothing Lasts Forever," Nielsen has written some truly creepy and compelling gore-horror scenes and some genuinely heartfelt character interaction scenes for Mulder and Scully matched with some superb superhero action with Juliet spiking murderous organ harvesters. There's a linking theme of youth and age and how some seek to defy it with supernatural-paranormal science, some expend it on vigilante exploits that lead to prison and some go with the flow.

But the end result: Mulder and Scully wander through the story and don't make any difference except for the worse -- which is to say that had they not gotten involved, the story would end with Juliet having killed the organ harvesters and set off to rid the world of more evildoers. Instead, because Mulder and Scully are involved, Juliet will now go to jail and the world of THE X-FILES is now deprived of a badass lady who stakes evil, bloodthirsty lunatics through the heart. Mulder and Scully have therefore made the world worse and the episode is simply a collection of nice moments.

"My Struggle IV" is much the same except Chris Carter isn't really a character oriented writer. His cool moments are action: car chases, William making people explode, Mulder and Scully running through the dark halls of an abandoned factory, a shootout, a car possibly running Skinner over. He's all about the action sequences and thriller escapades and as a result, there isn't much space for Mulder and William to reunite, for Scully to process William's parentage, for Mulder to grapple with the revelation.

There are truly nice scenes throughout: Mulder hugging William, Scully's revelation, Skinner explaining he helped the Smoking Man to gather more information, but they're so crowded out by empty action that they have no room to breathe. The shootouts and car chases and multiple sequences of Mulder getting close to William only for him to slip away add little to the story beyond delaying reunions and confrontations that come too quickly to have impact.

As a final episode (and it probably should be), it's effective enough in concluding the mess that is the myth-arc and ending with Mulder and Scully together and the X-Files Division shut down again (although it's unclear why it was reopened in the first place). Skinner's fate being left unknown is the only plot point that truly calls for resolution and it's irksome that Carter left that dangling for no real reason beyond the wish for a Season 12 despite Season 11 being Anderson's last (or so she says).

I think THE X-FILES under Chris Carter has come to a belated, awkward, strangely rushed yet overlong finale that wasted a lot of time but found some nice notes on which to conclude despite Skinner's frustratingly unknown status.

Re: The X-Files

I wonder if Anderson is really out, or if she is looking to get a huge pay raise after her last contract got so much press.


I don't have much to add to the finale conversation. I was just... All wrong. And Reyes. Wtf?

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Re: The X-Files

well.

https://twitter.com/GillianA/status/977221356893941760

Re: The X-Files

Wow. That's interesting.

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Re: The X-Files

I'm not sure what all the hubbub is about?  They sort of killed a bunch of characters off, revealed a whole lot of anti-climatic stuff, and whatnot.  Basically exactly what the show did 15 years ago. 

I am surprised they didn't go forward with other actors like Ambrose and Amell from last year.  I hope they return, maybe this time it's just 6-8 shows, and they can wrap the thing up once and for all.

266 (edited by RussianCabbie_Lotteryfan 2018-03-25 23:00:25)

Re: The X-Files

Generally speaking, it seemed like a large portion of fans liked it, but those that didn't -- including likely Gillian -- were disappointed in how Scully moves on from William so easily.  Gillian is a mother, I don't think she bought it.  And many fans were super attached to that boy.

It didn't bother me, but I definitely am not the hardcore female audience of this show.  It's a valid perspective, one that I don't think Chris Carter understands.  It's not clear who the show should be trying to appeal to.  I just love it either way.

Re: The X-Files

It was an incredibly dishonest moment, in an incredibly dishonest scene, in an incredibly dishonest episode. At no point we're the characters driving the vehicle. They were simply there to speak Carter's words.

I'm not a father. I'm certainly not a mother. However, I am a human being. I haven't gotten over my dogs that died nearly a year ago. I can't even imagine how I would react if anything bad happened to one of the kids in my family, much less something as horrible as what happened to William (or so they thought). Scully's reaction made her look inhuman... Which she may be, given that she is a 54 year old barren woman, pregnant with her third child.


Hmm... I think I just figured out how I'd write the next season, if Anderson really didn't want to come back. It would explain this whole revival, and why each episode feels like it takes place in a different universe! And it could undo some bad decisions! And it's a really bad idea, but it would explain so much!

Scully is dead. Her cancer returned at some point, and she died a quiet death, without any action or drama, and without conspiracy. And this caused Mulder to break. He is an aging, reclusive, depressed shell of his former self, stuck in an endless cycle of what could have been. Him and Scully, together again, doing what they always did best.
But something happens. A young agent finds himself (or herself) in a situation that they can't navigate, because there is no training for it. Mulder is their best option, but he is a mess. To help matters, Skinner could bring in another agent whose life was changed by Mulder and Scully, back in the 90s.

Or maybe Mulder is almost killed and the delusion happens when he is near death. Maybe the arc of the season can be about who tried to kill Mulder, and why. And Reyes can help, because she was never murdered.


These aren't really good ideas. Can anyone else do better?

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Re: The X-Files

I don't think Carter *really* meant to say that adopted children or children of surrogacy don't deserve to be loved. He wanted to dramatize Scully accepting that William didn't want her as his mother, but he wrote the dialogue carelessly. Carter seems to write in a very hurried, improvised fashion without much revision, thinking in terms of moments rather than stories.

The finale felt like a first draft where an editor would then declare that the action should be scaled back and the dramatic scenes -- Mulder and William reuniting, Scully discovering William is CGB Spender's son, Skinner and Reyes turning against the Smoking Man, William asking Scully to let her go, Mulder confronting CGB Spender -- should then be expanded. Carter doesn't outline, doesn't plan, just writes moments upon moments, then goes ahead and films. He doesn't believe in planning ahead; he says he likes to let inspiration strike him. But sometimes, inspiration only offers him B-movie action tropes.

**

I'm home sick today and maybe not thinking so clearly, but here's my proposal for "My Struggle V" -- which I actually imagined as "My Struggle IV," but it works just as well after the fourth installment.

It *does*, however, need Duchovny and Anderson back. So, here's how we go: we open with a voiceover shared between Mulder and Scully speaking to an unknown party, describing what the X-Files Division does from its origins in the 60s to Mulder and Scully discovering it in the 90s. The voiceover is overlaid on a sequence of an unknown figure breaking into the FBI headquarters (and passing by Skinner who is alive but walking with a cane). The figure comes to the door of the X-Files basement office. Begin opening titles.

After the titles, we see Mulder and Scully sitting on the floor of the office, opening file folders. Mulder, speaking to an unseen listener, shows a casefile and begins describing an X-File set during Season 3 and we get a 10 minute 'short' in which he's investigating a werewolf in Paris, Texas (although we see only the final confrontation in a zoo with Duchovny in deaging makeup and a hairpiece where Scully comes to his rescue).

Then Scully shares an X-File set during Season 9 where she was investigating a series of mass hallucinations alone, was exposed to a fear toxin (with Anderson in deaging makeup), but the Lone Gunmen and Mulder talked her through it over a phone call. This sequence also includes introducing the Lone Gunmen (old footage only that shows their magazine office, voiceovers for the phone call). Scully speaks of how it was never really about the X-Files or an alien invasion plot but instead the friendships and partnerships and trust between her and Mulder and all their friends -- Byers, Langley, Frohike, Danny, Pendrell, Doggett, Reyes, Skinner.

We end this flashback with Mulder and Scully revealing that they are packing up the X-Files after Kersh has closed it; Kersh required that they file everything away to get their severance. They have been addressing the intruder; the intruder is William. William said after he survived being shot in the head and drowning, he needed answers and sneaked into the X-Files office only to discover that there is no X-Files office. But maybe there could be. He holds up several winning lottery tickets.

Cut to: the former office of the Lone Gunmen magazine, abandoned and vacant. The door opens. Mulder, Scully and William enter. In a timelapse video, they move in furniture, workstations, TVs, whiteboards. A framed photo of the Gunmen is hung on the wall. In the next shot, we see William attaching a sign to the door of the office. The sign reads: X-FILES INVESTIGATIONS. Roll credits.

Post credits scene: the X-FILES INVESTIGATIONS website's contact form. Sound of a keyboard. Text appearing in the contact form describing a ghost sighting. Screen splits to another contact form shot with a municipal government wanting to hire Mulder and Scully to investigate a monster attack. The screen continues to divide we are seeing hundreds of case submissions from people seeking Mulder and Scully's services.

This isn't really an X-FILES sort of story, though. This is FRINGE. This is SLIDERS. This is STAR TREK. X-FILES doesn't really seek to be uplifting and hopeful. Even the finale, showing Mulder and Scully in each other's arms, left us knowing that Skinner could be lying dead under a car nearby.

Re: The X-Files

Going private could definitely work for Mulder and Scully, as well as others (Reyes should have been working with a private company that helps get people out of potentially dangerous cults). And part of me thinks that's the best way to go, given how much the FBI is pissing me off lately (not about Trump). However, part of me thinks that the show needs the FBI element. Maybe Mulder and Scully could be private consultants for the big new myth-arc, where they work with the FBI, but the rest of the time they work on their own?

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Re: The X-Files

I think Season 6 was pretty definitive: even without being assigned to the FBI's X-Files division, Mulder and Scully still investigate weirdness the way other couples go bowling. Going private allows them to bring their trainee, William, on cases. I think it's fine for them to be outside consultants to the bureau, but I don't think the show needs a myth-arc. It's never really had one, just a scattered number of episodes that are (mismatched) sequels to each other. Even the four "My Struggle" episodes were detached. Colonization had nothing to do with Sveta's story which had nothing to do with the Spartan virus which had nothing to do with William's mental manipulation powers which had nothing to do with the CSM actually wanting William for his immortality. The show would've been better with character arcs over a myth-arc.

Re: The X-Files

Probably true. I just like the element of having a case (or cases) which aren't resolved in one week. Perhaps a killer that Mulder can't profile for some reason, and he doesn't know if the guy is human or supernatural. But the alien mythology type stuff, where they go out of their way to no resolve it, is probably better left out

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Re: The X-Files

At this point -- I think Disney would be wise to offer Chris Carter a mid-budget series finale TV special -- maybe three 90 minute films done for a budget that would usually be assigned to make six episodes. Mandate that it is to be a conclusion. Wrap up this show. Make it an event, clear the deck for the X-FILES brand name. If Carter refuses, then hire Joel Wyman and Jeff Pinkner (FRINGE) to write the finale instead. The important thing is that the X-FILES be presented not as an abandoned product but as one that was resolved and concluded.

After that, I think it's time to reboot THE X-FILES. The concept of a paranormal procedural is fine, but a lot of thoughtless, unconsidered choices have marred the franchise over the years from missing the opportunity to wrap up the original myth-arc in a big budget finale to the anti-climax of I WANT TO BELIEVE and the clumsy retcon of the Revival.

I think Disney should bring the original show to an end in 2020. Then, in 2022, we should have a reboot. Fox Mulder, played by Summer Glau (yes!), is a 30-year-old FBI recruit on academic probabtion and voluntold to work on the X-Files Division. She becomes fascinated and enthralled by the paranormal cases to the dismay of full-fledged agent and medical doctor Dana Scully, played by Rupert Grint (with an American accent) who was also banished to the X-Files for some undisclosed indiscretion. Dr. Scully has spent his days debunking all the crazy, absurd reports with which no serious FBI agent could ever hope to make a career.

I think by gender swapping, you could avoid recasting and instead engage in a vivid reinterpretation and you could hire Duchovny and Anderson to play the parents of the rebooted Mulder and Scully.

Re: The X-Files

One thing you have to give George Lucas credit for: when he brought back Star Wars he was doing so to introduce it to an entirely new generation.  And it is highly commercially robust today as a result of that decision.  Something like X-Files is clearly not being brought back with the idea of folding those younger than even 30 into the mix.  And so it's audience keeps dwindling, especially as older fans move on from deep, serial drama.

If X-Files was rebooted, you could try to make it palatable for a younger generation.  But then someone would complain.  As they did when Lucas brought back Star Wars.

Re: The X-Files

Star Trek did that too. It took fans a while to realize that Picard wasn't there to replace Kirk, but once people caught on, they enjoyed it.

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Re: The X-Files

Informant wrote:

Star Trek did that too. It took fans a while to realize that Picard wasn't there to replace Kirk, but once people caught on, they enjoyed it.

Good point.

Re: The X-Files

Note: I haven't watched the finale.  So I don't know what was wrapped up and what wasn't, but I assume based on what I've scanned that it's a mess.

All that being said....I don't like reboots.  Whatever the property, I like the idea that the previous continuity exists in one way or another.  I prefer a "Next Generation" format when it comes to follow-ups because you're building on a foundation, even if that foundation is weak or full of holes.

I'm completely cool with ireactions' idea for a second series, but I'd make it a second series.  Whatever the conspiracy between Mulder/Scully/CSM/etc ends up being, it's over.  It's done.  And assuming it being done doesn't end the world, I think it's done.

So Summer Glau's character shows up at the FBI, and she stumbles upon the record of Fox Mulder.  She has her own ties to the supernatural, and she's interested in the fact that these files show that werewolves and vampires and aliens are potentially real.  And whether Fox is dead and whether Scully is in England, it really doesn't have to matter.  There can be a new, fresh conspiracy with no ties to the original....whether or not the original conspiracy made any sense.

That way, the universe continues to grow.  Maybe we see the ripples from some of Mulder's work, even though Mulder may or may not appear.  X-Files fans can get their new adventures with new characters and new villains....while also knowing that nothing that ever happened previously has been erased.

Re: The X-Files

I think Slider_Quinn21 raises a good point that a reboot could alienate old fans. And admittedly, when Chris Carter killed off Mr. Y, Erika Price and the Smoking Man, he freed the show from ever having to address the myth-arc again. There is no need to delve into Colonization or the Conspiracy of Men or the Spartan Virus any further. A reboot creates a clean slate, but we already have one.

So, here is my soft reboot proposal (without Gillian Anderson):

FBI Agent Tamlin Rivers (obviously played by Summer Glau) is in disgrace after a botched meth lab raid blew up in her face and killed 12 agents. She has scarring that's only partially hidden by her hair. She is reassigned to the most dead-end division in the bureau, the X-Files. She is briefed by Skinner (who is in a wheelchair after his injury).

Skinner says that the X-Files was shuttered by Kersh but then reopened under classified directive and he can't tell her too much about the past except that Rivers will be joining Agent Scully who has a wealth of knowledge and experience in paranormal investigations.

Rivers, a skeptic, heads down to the basement and is greeted by Agent William Scully (Miles Robbins). Glau protests that William is too young to be in the FBI; he's 18, the average recruit is 30. William dismisses all this with a smile and paperwork indicating he's a genuine FBI agent. He drags Rivers into their next case.

At one point in the premiere, William calls Mulder on the phone to ask for advice. We see Mulder in his house, holding a bag of breast milk by the fridge. William says he's not sure he can pull this off. Mulder assures William that he'll be great but reminds William that he's no longer immortal or telepathic and needs to not take crazy risks.

The conversation is interrupted by the sound of Scully screaming for Mulder off camera (using reused audio from Season 8's "Without" of Anderson screaming for Mulder in the desert) and a crying baby in the background (stock). Mulder apologizes and hangs up.

As Season 12 progresses, Rivers researches Scully and guesses that Scully is some sort of outside operative from deep in the Department of Defense somehow planted in the FBI with a false paper trail; this is thrown off by multiple colleagues at the FBI claiming to have known Scully for years.

Rivers has also heard of Agents Mulder and Scully, but when she tries to look up their records, their personnel files have been classified and their names and details have been redacted from the casefiles. As the season unfolds, Rivers finds William's peculiar ignorance of procedure and protocol to be frustrating and disturbing. He barely seems to consider the FBI a job. He sleeps on a sofa in the office.

At one point, Rivers discovers that William doesn't even get paid: payroll's never heard of him and he's been living off lottery ticket winnings (which are running out).

He's immature and juvenile, an obnoxious quality for Rivers who is a professional, precise and highly experienced agent. However, he is loyal and self-sacrificing and completely trustworthy despite being an unknown quantity, and William and Rivers develop a heated rapport of respectful teamwork.

After several standalones, we get a William focused episode and a revelation: William, losing control of his powers, broke into the defunct X-Files office to try to find answers. Reading the casefiles made him feel connected to Mulder (whom he considers his father even though they're brothers) and Scully, whom he considers his mother. The basement felt like home.

In a final burst of telepathic and psychokinetic energy, William rewrote the memories of everyone in the building to think of him as Agent William Scully and assigned to the X-Files (and had them fake the records). This burnt out his abilities, leaving him only human but having found a place where he belonged.

William called Mulder and Scully who were relieved to hear he was alive and encouraged him to take the X-Files Division forward. After more standalones, the Season 12 finale could have Duchovny (and maybe Anderson) guest-star to officially hand over the show to Rivers and William.

I can't see Chris Carter accepting this. Despite all the ridiculousness that Carter has written into his series and scripts -- Carter would balk at an 18-year-old boy being presented as an FBI agent.

Re: The X-Files

Hmm...

I'd probably do it without William. As I said before, I'd be fine having an agent who was connected to a past X-File as a child. Maybe Skinner would recruit that agent to work with a more by-the-books type of agent, who has a specialty in psychology (perhaps having worked with PTSD victims in the past, which could be interesting of his/her partner never really overcame their X-File experience).

The team could be fleshed out with more members, but that might get too crowded.

William has never worked for me, story-wise. Even baby William didn't work. So I'd just prefer to let him go with the old myth-arc.

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Re: The X-Files

I just can't make you people happy, can I?

Re: The X-Files

That's not true. I often enjoy reading your thoughts and ideas in regards to different movies and shows. However, I just don't really like William. smile

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Re: The X-Files

Why does William look just like John Connor from Sarah Connor Chronicles?

Re: The X-Files

I started watching the finale and had to stop with about 15 minutes remaining (including commercials).

NOTHING HAD HAPPENED YET.  Like, literally, nothing.

Re: The X-Files

Man... They should bring back The Sarah Connor Chronicles. smile

Watching these Chris Carter episodes is like a lesson in how not to stretch out a story. Not enough story to tell, so they just drive, and yell at each other without letting anyone finish a sentence, and act as though this is way more intense than it actually is.

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Re: The X-Files

Okay I finished it.  Nothing still really happened.  It was a really long chase scene, really.  And I just don't really know what the point of any of it was.  Was there a conspiracy or an alien pathogen or any of it?

Re: The X-Files

I like some of y'all's ideas for a continuation.  I think I might like Info's "Scully was dead the whole time" idea the best.

If it were me, I think I like "X-Files: the Next Generation" the best.  In the same way that I like a Sliders sequel to be Quinn, home on Earth Prime, sending out Sliders for various missions (an idea I toyed around with and outlined as an E214 sequel series).

I think you either use Mulder or Skinner or some other character connected to the series.  Heck, what if it's Kersch, who has some sort of weird supernatural episode and derails his own career to re-start the X-Files and investigate what happened to him.  He (any of the he's or any she) recruits two agents.  And in true Batman Beyond fashion, he recruits the same formula that worked in the past - a believer and a skeptic.  Gender-swap them if you want.  If it's Mulder, let him do most of his work on the phone or via television.  He's with Scully wherever they are.  If it's anyone else, have Mulder and Scully be retired.  Mention them but leave them be.  Maybe Mulder can show up in big Sweeps episodes to lend a hand.

But like TNG, let it be it's own thing.  That's how I'd handle it.

Re: The X-Files

Maybe Mulder and Scully are an X-File. They're just gone, and we see their file on Skinner's desk, along with many more, as ye recruits new agents.

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Re: The X-Files

Possibly.  But since My Struggle IV is canon, I'm cool letting them have a happy ending.  Maybe Skinner wants to investigate them because they've fallen so far off the grid, but it feels like "saving Quinn" in season 5 of Sliders.  What's the point if you aren't sure if Gillian is ever going to come back?

To keep with the TNG analogy, when that show first started....I think the natural assumption was that the TOS crew lived happy lives.  We see McCoy, and we know that he lived to a nice, old age.  It wasn't until episodes like "Relics" and movies like "Generations" that we learned what really happened to them.  I'd like X-Files to, at the very least, give the illusion that Mulder and Scully lived happily ever after.

And maybe in season 3, we can learn the real truth.  Because, of course, they can't live happily ever after smile

Re: The X-Files

William had a nightmare and blew them up by mistake. sad

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Re: The X-Files

There is a sad irony in watching Season 11 and noticing that SUPERNATURAL started out as a cheap X-FILES clone, but over the course of five seasons, SUPERNATURAL has corrected most of THE X-FILE's flaws, improved on almost all of its strengths and Season 11 seemed like an inept and overbudgeted clone of SUPERNATURAL.

THE X-FILES is a terribly incoherent show because of the freedom accorded to each episode's writer and the lack of concern for linking each episode even when they're meant to be sequels to each other.

This freedom is often cited as a strength of THE X-FILES where the blockbuster BOURNE movie heroics of "My Struggle IV" exist alongside a surreal comedy like "Forehead Sweat" and the buddy cop drama of "This" and the sci-fi lunacy of "Familiar." But SUPERNATURAL has shown that it can easily integrate a variety of tones and styles -- horror, action, comedy, metatextual commentary, theology, hopeful stories and bleak tales -- into a collective whole by making sure the lead characters have ongoing arcs and consistent voices even if the story around them this week has a different tone and genre from last week and next week.

THE X-FILES has also been applauded for isolating the myth-arc episodes from the monster of the week episodes, allowing standalone adventures that any audience member can tune into at any point with even myth-arc episodes being somewhat accessible. As Slider_Quinn21 notes, his inability to remember the details of the myth-arc actually helps him avoid confusion because he doesn't notice contradictions.

But SUPERNATURAL handles this so much better too. There are myth-arc episodes and there are monsters of the week, but SUPERNATURAL capably builds the myth-arc into the ongoing characterization and personal arcs, allowing standalone episodes to be thematically relevant to the myth-arc even if they aren't significant to the plot.

Sometimes, the monster of the week stories offer small pieces of information or equipment that may be useful in a myth-arc episode, but SUPERNATURAL is generally successful in making sure that each episode has a beginning and an end while serving as a chapter in a larger story. In addition, SUPERNATURAL is aware that it exists in an era of box sets and streaming whereas THE X-FILES seems terrified to let elements progress between episodes.

Both SUPERNATURAL and THE X-FILES are dealing with a complex mythology that can often be confusing. But THE X-FILES frequently denies its own history through blatant retconning and rewriting and refuses to acknowledge its own revisions. Mulder confronts the Smoking Man but the change from Colonization to the Spartan Virus isn't even mentioned; he later visits Deep Throat's grave and doesn't observe that Deep Throat seemed to be involved in a completely different conspiracy than what was unveiled in Season 10.

In contrast, SUPERNATURAL has wisely given its myth-arc separate chapters, closing one off before starting another. The apocalypse gave way to a civil war between angels which transitioned into the Leviathans and battling for control of Hell and moved into the Mark of Cain and shifted into the Darkness and then moved towards the Men of Letters and so forth.

You don't get SUPERNATURAL without THE X-FILES, but I think it's safe to say that SUPERNATURAL has surpassed its predecessor and is an improvement in nearly every area except budget and women and even that last one might change soon.

Re: The X-Files

I agree with all of that. I'd say that one of Supernatural's greatest weaknesses is that they kill off the human characters too often, whereas they should be building a large universe of recurring characters. But that's just my opinion.
In terms of women, they tend to go away because the Supernatural fangirls attack any woman who goes near the boys... Sometimes attacking the actresses in the real world. So the only option is to make the women more like sisters or mother's, which has allowed them to build up a nice little family of women. Now it's becoming a bit distracting that their only human friends and allies are all ass-kicking women.

Ultimately, Supernatural has to be a show about brothers. It's a guy show, with cars and guns. So while part of me wishes that they'd allowed Dean to make a family with Lisa and Ben, another part of me is glad that they didn't mess with the formula too much.

I guess The X-Files had a similar way with recurring characters. No real outside friends or love interests who weren't part of the action. Just a small group that kept the formula working.

Please be informed that the political, scientific, sociological, economic and legal views expressed in Informant's posts and social media accounts do not reflect any consensus of Sliders.tv.

Re: The X-Files

FYI -- BBC America is airing a X-Files 3-day 72-episode marathon, which started earlier today.

292 (edited by RussianCabbie_Lotteryfan 2018-04-02 09:15:06)

Re: The X-Files

I enjoyed these podcasts:  http://xfcast.libsyn.com/season-11-41-l … uggle-iv-0

http://xfcast.libsyn.com/season-11-40-c … truggle-iv

Not that the criticism hasn't been valid, but it's very supportive of the finale.  I liked some of the discussion of the perception of casual fans vs. the online ones as well.  I wonder how much FOX thinks of this, and Carter.

Re: The X-Files

Fox announced that there are no plans to bring X-Files back for another season at this time.  They might wait for Gillian to change her mind, but this could be it (for now...or, at least, for this iteration of it)

Re: The X-Files

um
https://twitter.com/GillianA/status/996050284525834240

Gillian is not changing her mind.

Re: The X-Files

Yeah, not likely. And I'm fine with it. Maybe someday, after Chris Carter retires and can never return, we can revisit the franchise.

Wait, is Disney going to own it? Because if so, we might get a millennial remake series on ABC in two years. Oh, and a reimagined Millennium, with Dylan Sprouse as Frank Black.

Please be informed that the political, scientific, sociological, economic and legal views expressed in Informant's posts and social media accounts do not reflect any consensus of Sliders.tv.

Re: The X-Files

Most people would agree Season 11 was better than Season 10.  But not for business.  It's interesting because from some of the analysis I have seen, what hardcore fans want and like from X-Files -- including comedy stuff -- is not what the casual audience wants and expects.

Re: The X-Files

It's pretty sad that Chris Carter had a feature film and SIXTEEN EPISODES and a high flying FOX budget and the all original actors and Vancouver and he STILL couldn't wrap up his show.

Re: The X-Files

I think something is wrong with Chris Carter. He was never the best writer on the show, but some of the decisions that went into this final season (especially the finale) were beyond just bad writing. There is no person in their right mind who would have written the Scully pregnancy reveal and thought that it was a perfectly legitimate plot twist... for so many reasons that it's hard to list them all.

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Re: The X-Files

I think Chris Carter has said in interviews that he never intended for the X-Files to have a proper ending.  Something like "life never ends, why should the X-Files?"

Re: The X-Files

...because it is a story.

There's a difference between a "life goes on" ending and a "we have no idea what we're doing" ending. With his logic, why didn't the series start when Mulder was conceived?

Please be informed that the political, scientific, sociological, economic and legal views expressed in Informant's posts and social media accounts do not reflect any consensus of Sliders.tv.