This is just my personal approach -- for me, the prequels are not canon because they're hopelessly in opposition to the original trilogy. Saying Leia didn't train to become a ghost and wouldn't become one ignores how Vader didn't train to bcome a ghost either, and here is no reconciling the discrepancy, just as there is no explaining how Leia remembers her mother in ROTJ but is shown to be adopted at birth in ROTS. The prequels are not a viable source and the two Disney SW films have, aside from using some of the actors, largely stepped away from them, treating them almost like the novels, comics and video games that were relabelled under the LEGENDS brand.
3,661 2017-04-17 19:31:43
Re: Star Wars: Movies and Shows on Disney+ and More (330 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
3,662 2017-04-17 14:42:25
Re: Star Wars: Movies and Shows on Disney+ and More (330 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
JJ Abrams says she didn't train and that he doesn't consider her to be a Jedi in THE FORCE AWAKENS, but she clearly remains Force sensitive. I don't think Anakin ever trained to become a Force ghost, but he appears at the end of RETURN OF THE JEDI, so there's some wiggle room, but Lucas deciding in the prequels that not all Jedi bodies fade into the Force does allow an explanation for Leia's ghost to be a no-show in EPISODE IX. The truth is that the prequels are not a particularly helpful source of information as their information is regularly at odds with the original trilogy from details (all Jedi inexplicably dress in Tatooine desert outfits) to large strokes (the arcane religious order of the Jedi served as leading political figures in the Republic?). There's no squaring those circles.
3,663 2017-04-16 21:28:34
Re: Star Wars: Movies and Shows on Disney+ and More (330 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
Leia is a Jedi, which introduces another wrinkle in Carrie Fisher's death as Obi-Wan, Yoda, Anakin and Qui-Gon were Force ghosts. Will they have to find some way to explain why she doesn't appear as a ghost? Even Alec Guinness appeared in THE FORCE AWAKENS despite being dead.
3,664 2017-04-15 22:08:43
Re: Star Wars: Movies and Shows on Disney+ and More (330 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
I do think there's a certain courage in refusing to make Episode IX by pretending that Carrie Fisher isn't dead, accepting that reality and trying to work with it?
The CG Tarkin and Leia in Rogue One were necessary for telling the story of the Death Star and leading into A New Hope, but if not for that narrative purpose, they probably wouldn't have done it.
3,665 2017-04-15 12:20:57
Re: Star Wars: Movies and Shows on Disney+ and More (330 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
So... Carrie Fisher isn't going to appear in EPISODE IX in any form; not in repurposed outtakes. Not as a digital character. On one level, it really sucks. On another, death always sucks, so if the production can find some way to mine Fisher's absence and make the audience feel it in a way that serves the film as opposed to detracting from it, it could work. Maybe EPISODE IX could be set after a large time gap from EPISODE VIII in which Leia died.
3,666 2017-04-14 18:02:50
Re: Marvel Cinematic Universe by Slider_Quinn21 (934 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
We don't talk about it much, but I think Agents of Shield has really found its footing. I actually look forward to watching it each week, and I think it's a lot of fun. It's annoying that the movies don't care about it, and it's crazy that AoS takes place in the same universe as Daredevil. But for what it is, I think it's a lot of fun. Ghost Rider was a fun story, LMD was zany but allowed for some great character work, and I think Agents of Hydra will be pretty cool too.
Bringing back (spoiler) is upsetting, but hopefully they do it right.
I haven't watched the show in months. I started this season watching, but eventually forgot to watch and didn't care. Then I went and watched an episode and it just seemed stupid, so I never went back. I never got past the Ghost Rider story.
I don't really know how to describe AGENTS OF SHIELD, and every time I try, I ramble endlessly. I think the best way I have to explain the show is that it has constantly reinvented itself with each season and with Season 4, they did the annual reinvention early, in the middle of the season, wrapping up the Ghost Rider arc and shifting into the artificial intelligence war.
Season 1 was the children's version of a spy show and the series only seemed to find its footing when SHIELD was destroyed and the agents were made fugitives and outsiders which is a more Marvel-approach than having them as agents of the establishment. Season 2 were the agents trying to do their jobs when it wasn't their job anymore and it set up the Inhuman arc of Season 3 which did a really neat job of finally creating Inhumans to truly represent the best Marvel characters as misfits and freaks.
With Season 2, there was a cinematic, crisp, fast-paced approach to the show with tight editing and a snappy sense of rhythm. The series also pushed the actors to their limits with Clark Gregg, Chloe Bennett, Elizabeth Henstridge and Iain De Caestecker playing characters who were increasingly strained and maddened and pushed to their limits. And Brett Dalton as Grant Ward found deeper and more disturbing layers of horror and twisted monstrosity in a character who initially seemed incredibly bland and flat. The Ghost Rider arc was very fulfilling and exiting. The AI war has really grabbed me with the nightmarish Framework environment.
But I honestly can't point to any coherent throughline or central purpose to the series beyond being an exciting, PG-13 espionage series in the Marvel Cinematic Universe. It isn't a film noir adventure like DAREDEVIL; it's not a detective drama like JESSICA JONES; it's not a street-level exercise in atmosphere like LUKE CAGE; it's not a goofy space comedy like GUARDIANS and it's not a charming character piece like ANT MAN. It was a supernatural procedural thriller in the Ghost Rider arc and it's currently a techno-action spy adventure. Who knows what it'll be next week?
3,667 2017-04-14 16:51:54
Re: Star Wars: Movies and Shows on Disney+ and More (330 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
Looks like reports of EPISODE IX using Carrie Fisher's outtakes were greatly exaggerated.
3,668 2017-04-14 16:09:00
Re: Star Wars: Movies and Shows on Disney+ and More (330 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
Looks like they're taking the Slider_Quinn21 approach.
Just watched ROGUE ONE and I think it may have played better for people with a reverent, all-consuming love for STAR WARS: A NEW HOPE. For me, it was a lot of careful and precise callbacks and references to a film I like well enough and respect for its role in history, but I guess I'm not *that* huge a STAR WARS fan. Even stuff like the way the ROGUE ONE ending leads directly into A NEW HOPE didn't give me the same sense of myth and awe as, say, the STAR TREK novel where Kirk in the 24th century says he needs to compare notes with Sisko on time travel someday.
I think the problem is probably that to me, an attempt to pastiche the 1977 film and to understandably do so without Luke, Han and Leia just didn't really connect for me; I'm more into characters than the era or even the cinematic style which, while groundbreaking in 1977, is pretty standard today.
3,669 2017-04-11 15:40:13
Re: The X-Files (438 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
Informant, Slider_Quinn21, RussianCabbie, Grizzlor -- I am mildly irked by your posts in this thread regarding the audiobooks. I spend a lot of time crafting my contributions to this Bboard, many of which were in this thread regarding the IDW published Season 10 - 11 comics. The audiobooks have been announced as adaptations of the SEASON 10 - 11 comics on which I wrote extensively. Despite this, none of you seem to know anything about them even though I've described them in lavish detail in previous posts in this thread.
I am fractionally upset to the point where I shall refuse to talk to any of you ever again for the next thirty seconds or so.
..............................
Alrighty then. So, the comic book SEASON 10 - 11 are being adapted into audio productions with the banner title of COLD CASES with the actual actors. This is both interesting and confusing in that the IDW comic books and the FOX revival are completely irreconcilable, yet the press release is presenting COLD CASES as set between I WANT TO BELIEVE and the Revival.
From a continuity standpoint, that's impossible. SEASON 10 had Mulder and Scully rejoining the FBI in 2013; the Revival had them rejoining in 2015 with no reference to an earlier and abortive return to the FBI. SEASON 10 had Mulder and Scully as a settled, permanent couple; the Revival shows them having broken up. SEASON 10 has Mulder and Scully discovering that William Mulder has gone missing and his foster parents have been murdered; the Revival has them believing William is safe. SEASON 10 has promoted Skinner to Deputy Director; the Revival has Skinner still an Assistant Director. SEASON 10 has Mulder and Scully reopening the X-Files in 2013; the Revival has Skinner saying nobody's been in the Basement since the show got cancelled.
The main discrepancy: SEASON 10 treats Colonization as genuine. The 2012 invasion doesn't seem to have happened, but the comics indicate that the invasion has been delayed due to different alien factions warring over who will dominate the Earth. The faceless rebels return; there's buried spaceships, the black oil makes a comeback.
Confirming the Colonization plot is also the revelation that all Syndicate members periodically had their memories and personalities copied into clone bodies to carry on their work should the originals be killed, and a mysterious figure creates a new Syndicate comprised clones of all the deceased members, including the Cigarette Smoking Man. This is impossible to fit with the Revival's reveal that Colonization was a hoax to distract from the Smoking Man's Spartan Virus endgame. In fact, when reading the comics, one gets the sense that the Revival is set in an alternate continuity and it's the comics that take place in the TV show's universe.
This sense that the Revival is not set in the same reality as the original TV show is further deepened in the SEASON 11 finale: Mulder and the mystery man, revealed to be a now adult Gibson Praise, confront each other in the desert. It's revealed that Gibson has distributed the alien-repelling magnetite mineral throughout the Earth, making the planet a decidedly inhospitable place for the Colonists. As a spaceship comes at Gibson's beckoning, reality is briefly ripped open and Mulder sees a glimpse of alternate universes -- and one glimpse shows Scully with her Revival hairstyle and Mulder in his "My Struggle" costume -- determinedly separating the continuity of the comics and the TV show as taking place on parallel tracks.
I really don't know how an adaptation of SEASON 10 and SEASON 11's comic books can serve as a middle chapter that bridges I WANT TO BELIEVE and the Revival. SEASONS 10 - 11 end by declaring themselves apocryphal and offering a gentle finale to the alien myth-arc. That said, audiobook director Dirk Maggs has a history of adapting what seems initially unadaptable. The HITCHHIKER'S GUIDE radio series had finished two seasons and ended on a cliffhanger where Arthur Dent discovers that his friend, Zaphod, had allowed Earth to be destroyed. Arthur stole Zaphod's ship and vowed revenge. The novels, however, had adopted the material from the radio show and then gone well past it with original material that didn't incorporate this revelation or cliffhanger. And then Maggs was hired to do a radio series that would adapt the latter books into the radio format despite the mismatch.
Maggs, clumsily but perhaps unavoidably, declared that the cliffhanger had been a bad dream. In addition, the fifth and final book of the series, MOSTLY HARMLESS, ended on another cliffhanger where most of the characters were killed off and the author died before he could finish it. Maggs adapted MOSTLY HARMLESS faithfully but with an additional end-scene where the characters were shown to have survived.
So, could Maggs do something similar and retrofit his adaptation of SEASON 10 and SEASON 11 for an in-continuity approach? I don't know, because the problem isn't really the comics; if anything, it's the TV Revival that's out of step with continuity. However, SEASON 11's final issue ended the storyline with a reality warping event caused by an alien spacecraft, so I guess Maggs could alter the story to have reality rewritten with the aliens retroactively having never existed and the stage cleared for the Revival storyline... ?
3,670 2017-04-09 08:34:21
Re: DC Superheroes on TV & Streaming (1966 - 2024) (1,683 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
I think that the LEGENDS showrunners are good -- they both ran CHUCK well -- but on LEGENDS, they don't seem to have been given the authority to fully manage the show. Articles suggest that the executive producers of ARROW and FLASH are doing the same job on LEGENDS except where they are fully developing and reviewing scripts for ARROW and FLASH, they are much more removed from LEGENDS scripting process while still needing to revise and approve each script, and possibly not giving LEGENDS their full attention.
With SUPERGIRL, the lead showrunner is clearly Ali Adler with the ARROW/FLASH producers overseeing but not managing. With LEGENDS -- it's like the show doesn't have a full time story editor and it really shows.
3,671 2017-04-08 05:18:20
Re: DC Superheroes on TV & Streaming (1966 - 2024) (1,683 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
I can't really quibble with ANY of Slider_Quinn21's thoughts on LEGENDS. Of all the CW superhero shows, LEGENDS has the least amount of logic to it and the greatest amount of odd narrative errors and unjustified leaps. In Season 1, Hawkgirl got stranded in the past with Ray Palmer and an episode later, it might as well have never happened; in the finale, Hawkgirl got stranded again and randomly found a helmet that she inexplicably knew to be in Rip's possession in the future and used it to plant a message despite the helmet having never been previously introduced onscreen. LEGENDS does not setup its payoffs well and often fails to pay off its setups.
I've written an explanation for Eobard's place in continuity (it's post-Season 1 of THE FLASH) -- http://sliders.tv/bboard/viewtopic.php?pid=5394#p5394 -- but even that explanation notes that the dialogue where Eobard refers to the Season 1 finale and the Season 3 premiere was incorrectly written, an error that the writers missed.
With Season 2, we have Mick betraying the Legends with almost no consequence; after punching him a few times, the Legends once again fight alongside him and there is no consideration to Mick's role on the team and they continue to treat him as their personal attack dog while Mick's loyalties remain questionable. It might as well have never happened. There's mismatched scenes in sequence throughout Season 2 such as the Legends inexplicably letting Rip Hunter get captured and proceeding to kick back with a STAR WARS marathon rather than scouring all reality for their captured friend.
There's a lot of joy and enthusiasm to LEGENDS, but also a bizarre sense that scripts are not being properly reviewed before filming. No show is devoid of error, but the errors on LEGENDS are so obvious. Even if LEGENDS couldn't fit the casts of ARROW and FLASH into Doomworld and needed the LEGENDS cast kept intact, some brief explanation was needed as to why Eobard Thawne kills Barry Allen but spares the Legends or why the WWII time period was left intact for a second effort to regain the Spear.
DOCTOR WHO would have thrown out a quick explanation that the Legion of Doom has never really taken the Legends seriously as a threat and consider them the misfits and rejects compared to the ARROW and FLASH teams and said something about the WWII episode being a fixed point in time needed to anchor the Doomworld reality. LEGENDS doesn't even try.
One gets the sense the DC TV staff need to hire more producers; there are too few people being stretched too thin across ARROW, FLASH, SUPERGIRL and LEGENDS.
3,672 2017-04-03 16:32:31
Re: Marvel Cinematic Universe by Slider_Quinn21 (934 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
I don't understand the IRON FIST series at all. Why did Marvel TV commission a series about a martial artist character but fill the series with corporate intrigue and boardroom debates instead of martial arts action?
Why did Marvel TV hire an actor with no fighting skills and no time to learn how to fake it to play a master martial artist in this show?
Why did Marvel TV greenlight a show about Iron Fist when the Iron Fist superpower is barely present and Danny Rand never wears the Iron Fist costume?
Why did Marvel TV want to do an Iron Fist TV show about the character's origin story where the mystical city in which the story takes place -- K'un Lun -- is never shown onscreen and where the magic dragon -- which each applicant must fight to become the Iron Fist -- never appears in person?
Why is Harold Meachum the final villain of the first season when Harold has been established as weaker than the Hand ninjas and subservient to villains that Iron Fist has already defeated and dispatched?
If Marvel TV felt uncomfortable with the martial arts, the costume, the mystical city from which the martial arts came, the superpower and the origin behind the superpower, why are they doing this show at all?
IRON FIST is a series that doesn't seem to have any concrete goals and it keeps sabotaging itself throughout its run.
It's almost as though somebody decided years previous that Netflix would have a DEFENDERS series featuring Daredevil, Jessica Jones, Luke Cage and Iron Fist who'd first appear in their individual shows, but the Iron Fist show was thrown together at the last second to justify the character appearing in DEFENDERS without any sense of what IRON FIST would be and no commitment or interest in the aspects of Iron Fist that are present in the comics.
3,673 2017-04-02 20:14:22
Re: Marvel Cinematic Universe by Slider_Quinn21 (934 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
IRON FIST is pretty mediocre. The corporate machinations are extremely dull and Finn Jones is thoroughly uninteresting as the already blandly scripted Danny Rand. Colleen Wing and Claire Temple are pretty much perfection, though, and they elevate the series from lifelessly indistinct to watchable. The drunken boxen sequence was good, though.
3,674 2017-03-29 20:39:59
Re: DC Superheroes on TV & Streaming (1966 - 2024) (1,683 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
Katie Cassidy is a good actress, but I think the #NoLaurelNoArrow crowd would prefer the real Laurel back and Black Siren would just remind them of what they've lost. I still miss Harry even though the actor never left.
Just to weird people out, I say they should hire Katherine Ryan to play Black Siren as well and they should alternate between shots.
3,675 2017-03-29 16:51:09
Re: DC Superheroes on TV & Streaming (1966 - 2024) (1,683 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
Why are you still giving opinions about things you haven't watched? Didn't you learn the sheer stupidity of this after you reviewed the monster busting sequences of SLIDERS REBORN based on reading someone else's email on it instead of actually reading ithe pages yourself?
3,676 2017-03-28 17:43:36
Re: Skyraker? (5 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
Wouldn't it be better to start with something small like a weather station, be sure of all the safety concerns, then graduate to a small facility akin to Skylab and then work up in gradual steps to doing an apartment complex... ?
3,677 2017-03-27 18:39:20
Re: Personal Status Updates! (759 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
Well, it's your money. But it does occur to me that this discussion highlights the differences you and I have in approaching hardware. To me, a company sending out a software update that bricks the phone wouldn't be a problem; I'd either reflash a backup or go so far as to reflash the entire ROM. That's not a chore for everyone.
There's stuff I like about Samsung and stuff I don't. I really like their hardware, but I really hate their software. Before I lost my Samsung S5, I wasn't running Samsung's Android; I put Cyanogenmod (now Lineage) on it because I wanted the plain Google experience but mostly because Samsung doesn't let you hide the status bar.
And that's a huge problem on an AMOLED screen because images retained tend to burn in and most Samsung Galaxy phones have ghost images of text, the keyboard and the status bar burnt into the screen after a few months. And the only way around that is to use expanded desktop mode (hiding the status bar) and adjusting the visual settings in a way Samsung's blocked off. It also irritates me that Samsung's method for shifting apps to microSD seems completely broken and outright sabotaged and the only way to get Google's measures for merging a microSD with the internal memory was to replace Touchwiz with a cleaner ROM.
Motorola doesn't actually exist anymore. They were bought by Google who turned it into an outlet for Nexus style phones that were a lot cheaper, then sold to Lenovo who dissolved it while maintaining the Moto brand. Lenovo kept the great prices but stopped doing the regular software updates -- but it doesn't matter to me because I'm not even using their ROM anymore; I've switched to Lineage OS.
The Moto E2 and G4 have yet to receive an update from Marshmallow in my area, but I've already skipped ahead to Android Nougat. So... I guess I deliberately buy phones with lots of custom ROMs and don't depend on the manufacturer for software. I'm less about features and more about how active the device is in the XDA forums.
3,678 2017-03-26 16:54:56
Re: Marvel Cinematic Universe by Slider_Quinn21 (934 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
Informant not knowing what a homecoming dance is only deepens my grief for him and his genetic inability to have fun. Stay strong, buddy. We'll get through this.
**
I sure hope Claire shows up soon! I only got around to watching LUKE CAGE now. Honestly, while Luke Cage is one of my favourite Avengers (he plays the straightman to the insanity of Tony Stark and Thor), I'm not really into stories about street gangs. But once I got past that, I really enjoyed this series -- and I've decided that Claire is my favourite MCU character.
3,679 2017-03-25 08:52:28
Re: Personal Status Updates! (759 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
The new Samsung Galaxy is coming out soon and I need to save money for one, because my S4 is slowing down. So that, and maybe some marketing for my books to reduce the stress level... Then I can promise to pretend to have fun for a while.
I cannot in good conscience support the purchase of Samsung's overpriced, overdesigned, overly incendiary products, and I say that as someone who bought the Samsung Galaxy S3 three times. There was a time when to get a decent Android phone, you had to spend $700 - $800 USD; that's simply not the case anymore.
You can get a 1080p, 5.5-inch Android phone with 16 GB of storage, microSD and a clean version of Android in the Motorola G4 for $180 off Amazon. (I'm using one now.) You can get a 5.7 inch LG Stylo 2 Plus or a Sony Xperia XA for $200. You can get a BLU Life One X2 Mini with 64GB of memory and a 5-inch screen for $180.
Once you're at 1080p, you can't really distinguish between that and higher resolutions on a phone sized screen, all these 'budget' phones have the gyroscope and compass sensors, so the only thing you get for all the extra money is Samsung Pay. Is that really worth it?
3,680 2017-03-24 14:50:23
Re: DC Superheroes on TV & Streaming (1966 - 2024) (1,683 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
I want to take this moment to express my utmost sympathy for Informant's medical situation (the man can't have fun!) and to propose a Kickstarter where half the proceeds will go to further research on Informant's genetic disorder and the other half will go to paying for Informant and Slider_Quinn21 to go to that movie theatre where they serve you dinner. We should convince them to record their entire conversation for sharing on this forum.
As for Oliver's big revelation -- I think there is some truth to it, but it is not as simple or straightforward as Prometheus would have Oliver think. Very simply: killing is a highly enjoyable and pleasurable activity -- which is to say that killing in combat triggers adrenaline and serotonin in the brain and creates euphoria. Some war veterans have described a certain peaceful serenity in combat situations as they become acclimatized to violence while others find it traumatizing and disturbing; I think Oliver is more on the former end of that scale than the latter.
So, saying Oliver likes killing is the equivalent of saying I like sugar; desiring it doesn't mean acting on it and Oliver has gone many years without killing people with no psychological withdrawal for it. He's not the Punisher, who is actually addicted to killing.
3,681 2017-03-24 09:08:18
Re: DC Superheroes on TV & Streaming (1966 - 2024) (1,683 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
Temporal Flux said awhile back and well before this week's LEGENDS:
Hadn't really put too much thought into Legends, but something clicked with me this morning. I think I see where they're going with Snart.
So Flashpoint Thawne is after the spear of destiny so that he can use it to alter reality and will himself back into existence. Meanwhile, Heatwave is hallucinating Snart speaking to him; but it's the classic Snart who is evil.
I think Heatwave is going to end up with his hands on the spear of destiny; and either on purpose or by accident, he's going to will Snart back into existence. However, it's going to be a slightly different outcome than what Thawne is seeking. The Snart that Heatwave would bring back is not going to be the original one who sacrificed himself. The Snart that comes back is going to be whatever perception of Snart Heatwave had in his mind. It could be a full reset button with no hint of goodness left in Snart; he would only be the cold calculator with a fierce sense of loyalty (as he should be).
Temporal Flux proves to be mostly right! I love Temporal Flux. :-)
3,682 2017-03-24 09:02:35
Re: DC Superheroes on TV & Streaming (1966 - 2024) (1,683 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
I've said before in response to Informant's distaste for SUPERGIRL: Informant clearly has a genetic condition that makes him incapable of having fun. And I stand by that. That said, the musical episode BLOWS. Oh my God, it was so clumsy for all the reasons Informant notes (listless characterization, songs that don't connect to the arcs and were written for an entirely different project and purpose, nonsensical guest-stars in a dreamscape that's supposed to be Kara's and Barry's yet features people they've never met).
I think the problem here is clearly scheduling: if you were going to have SUPERGIRL and FLASH crossover again, this time, you'd want Melissa Benoist visiting Central City, meeting Gustin's supporting cast and getting into that mix.
Unfortunately, SUPERGIRL, transferring from CBS, didn't have the shutdown days built into its schedule the way all the other CW superhero shows had set up in order to give actors days where production on their home show would suspend so they could film on other shows and facilitate the crossovers.
This is why Supergirl was reduced to a near-cameo role in the last two episodes of the "Invasion" crossover; Melissa Benoist had to run back to the set of SUPERGIRL, and the same thing seems to have happened here again where Supergirl's scenes are with her unconscious, in an isolated dreamscape and briefly at STAR Labs. There's a real sense of filming everything with Benoist inside 1 - 2 days much in the same way Michael Rosenbaum reprised his role as Lex for a single day of filming on SMALLVILLE's finale and only had two scenes.
So we end up with a script where the writers are struggling to make a whole scene out of Benoist's limited availability and we end up with this awkward mess. The use of Barrowman and Garber strikes me as the creators trying to give a crossover feel to a crossover where the central guest from another show, Kara, isn't even in it all that much.
The producers say they've worked in shutdown days for SUPERGIRL next year.
3,683 2017-03-21 12:13:18
Re: Random Thoughts about TV, Film and Media (698 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
TMNT ODYSSEY is a series finale for the Mirage comics that, like SLIDERS REBORN, seeks to address a sea of unresolved plots and posting tribute to a labyrinth of continuity while telling its own story in addition to serving as a definite conclusion.
The story: a mysterious time traveling and reality warping villain is destroying realities containing versions of the Ninja Turtles, wiping out the first and second animated shows, the live action films, the Archie published comics and it’s up to the aged Mirage Turtles to confront this enemy known only as the Shogun.
The Shogun turns out to be a future version of Michelangelo driven mad by several cosmic artifacts and grief over the Turtle family haven drifted apart and by how all his parallel universe counterparts are not thinkers and writers but absent minded goofballs. He seeks to destroy reality and rebuild it into his ideal multiverse in which his family will never separate or die.
The Turtles fight their brother to the end of time. Raphael kills Michelangelo and Leonardo grabs the cosmic object just before all of reality is destroyed. The multiverse reforms and the new worlds include the IDW comics, the Michael Bay films, the Nickelodeon series and potentially more.
It's nicely written by Andrew Modeen and it's drawn by TMNT comic veteran Jim Lawson, so despite being fan fiction, it fits right in with the official Mirage comics and easy to see as canonical.
It’s a good finale. The Turtles are all old now, still excellent fighters but worn down by injuries and sadness. The unfinished Volume 4 is integrated into ODYSSEY through a sequence of the Turtles annual camping trip at multiple points in their lifetimes, one of which is set during Volume 4 without specifying how that volume ended.
The Turtles, traveling across time and space to find the Shogun, are joined by survivors of characters from the other continuities, showing respect to every version of the Turtles. There’s extensive tribute to Mirage comics to observe what’s being concluded.
The ending directs readers to embrace the new Ninja Turtles shows, films and comics while heralding the Mirage comics as the core source material and assuring us that the previous incarnations lived full lives even if they did so out of sight from the readers. NINJA TURTLES ODYSSEY takes the Turtles to the end of their lives and then shows them reborn.
3,684 2017-03-20 21:03:36
Re: Random Thoughts about TV, Film and Media (698 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
#34 is a delightfully psychological tale with some great jokes. #38 - 40 would be funnier if the story were compressed into a single issue; they didn't have enough jokes for three installments. My favourite of the guest-era are the three Michael Zulli issues.
I finished reading the Mirage finale, ODYSSEY. This is essentially the SLIDERS REBORN of NINJA TURTLES; a parallel-reality spanning epic made by the fans for the fans and at their own expense. It's pretty amazing, but the fact that it exists speaks to the sheer failure of the actual creators.
3,685 2017-03-20 16:49:35
Re: Random Thoughts about TV, Film and Media (698 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
It's true that many of the Mirage TMNT comics are excellent. The initial 21 issues and the four one-shots are, despite missteps, very strong in terms of their superb artistry as Kevin Eastman and Peter Laird blend beautiful artwork and superb storytelling into hyperdynamic action and deeply stirring contemplation. There are problems like their bizarre design choices meaning it's hard to tell the Turtles apart and the long delays between individual issues was absurd. They are good comics.
The guest-era, from #22 - 44 when Eastman and Laird were too busy managing licensing and franchising to write and draw comics, is filled with excellent work. Eastman and Laird returned to writing the series with Jim Lawson drawing the epic "City at War" arc which is also a very serious, thoughtful, action packed story. There isn't any of the humour from the original animated show or the Nickelodeon series, but the lunacy of the Turtles comes through -- although, as I said, the fact that you can't tell any of them apart speaks poorly of Eastman and Laird's design skiils.
Volume 2 is an awkward, unfinished, abruptly concluded mess. Volume 3's pretty good if you make sure to read the fan-published issues. Volume 4 is filled with beautiful artistry and many of the TALES OF THE TMNT stories are excellent, but the unfinished, inconclusive nature of the series means nobody should read it. The TMNT Entity blog remarked that most readers could stop at "City of War" and feel like they had a complete, finished, satisfying product without stepping into the incomplete material of Volumes 2 - 4.
I'm still in the middle of TMNT: ODYSSEY.
3,686 2017-03-20 06:43:16
Re: Random Thoughts about TV, Film and Media (698 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
*closes eyes*
Back in the 1980s, Donatello found a magic pen in April's apartment building that would bring whatever drawn with it to life. It turns out that April's father drew her with the pen and dear God why did April, a normal person in a crazy world, need to be a magical creature why why why?
3,687 2017-03-19 20:20:41
Re: Random Thoughts about TV, Film and Media (698 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles Volume 4 is totally unreadable.
Volume 4 is where Kevin Eastman (hyperintense action writer and artist) sold his share of TMNT to Peter Laird and Peter Laird carried on alone. The thing about the original TMNT -- I mean, it was messy and poorly paced and incomplete and amateurish, but the talent was unmistakable: crazy action, absurd visuals, philosophical contemplation and grand sci-fi concepts.
With Eastman gone and taking his stylized action lunacy with him, Laird's writing and artistic sensibilities dominate Volume 4 -- and so what we have are 32 issues with about eight issues of content. This is a series where half an issue is just panels of a spaceship landing, where the bulk of an issue's pages are the Turtles doing automotive repair on a truck, where the last page of one issue is a lengthy text piece from Peter Laird about how much he loves his new Segway.
The series is a drawn out mess of incoherent plot threads: aliens land on Earth and offer their tech freely, meaning the Turtles can now walk around in public and are thought of as visiting aliens. Donatello is shrunken down to action figure size, Michelangelo goes off to space, Splinter dies of old age, April discovers she's a being of pure imagination -- none of these plot threads have any linking theme, and the focus of the stories is so scattered and confused that you wonder where it's all going and you suspect it's going nowhere. That suspicion turns out to be correct: Volume 4 took 14 years to release 32 issues and ended on a cliffhanger.
Peter Laird began Volume 4 with great enthusiasm only to get sidetracked by producing the 2003 animated series, a series he describes as a true representation of his vision of the Turtles. In contrast, Volume 4 starts out strong but Laird's distraction and lack of commitment becomes apparent with the meandering stories that he couldn't even be bothered to wrap up. To be fair, Laird confessed to being burnt out on the comic and the animated series and losing all passion for the Turtles -- but there is really no excuse for not finishing what he started.
In addition to the abortion that's Volume 4, Laird spearheaded a second anthology volume of TALES OF THE TMNT -- which had the bizarre editorial direction where story arcs would not be published sequentially. By that, I mean that even though there were multi-issue arcs, the installments would be separated by unrelated stories. For example, there was a "Gang Wars" story about New York's organized crime after the Turtles defeated the Foot Clan -- but each issue of "Gang Wars" in Tales of the TMNT would be followed by three to 20 issues of other stories before the next installment of "Gang Wars" and then "Gang Wars" never even finished because Laird sold the franchise to Viacom and gave up on Ninja Turtles comics.
There is a shocking indifference to reader enjoyment here that is just unbelievable and it simply cements my opinion: do not read the original run of NINJA TURTLES. Life's too short to read comics from creators who are so indifferent to their readers. Leave that to crazy completists like me. Stick to the Nickelodeon series.
*throws all the Mirage NINJA TURTLES comics into the fireplace*
Oh, wait. There's one left. TMNT: ODYSSEY. The final Mirage TMNT comic -- not published by Mirage but by that crazy fanboy who loved these comics so much (why?) that he paid writers and artists for a final chapter. Fine. I'll read it.
3,688 2017-03-17 18:23:30
Re: DC Superheroes on TV & Streaming (1966 - 2024) (1,683 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
According to Matt Letscher on Twitter, the Thawne on LEGENDS OF TOMORROW is from just after the Season 1 finale of THE FLASH. He's a a time remnant. I think that makes sense -- but some of the dialogue in "Legion of Doom" is oddly sequenced.
The sequence of events, according to Letscher, is this: Eobard travels back in time to kill Nora Allen. Barry prevents this, but after imprisoning Thawne for months, Barry releases him to let him murder Nora after all. Then, this Thawne resumes the Season 1 course of events: after killing Nora and speeding off, he discovers that he has lost his connection to the Speed Force and everything unfolds as we saw in Season 1, but with the addition that after Eddie shoots himself, Eobard attempted to escape his erasure by hiding in the Speed Force.
The problem with this is that in "Legion of Doom," Eobard's dialogue is specifically: "My ancestor killed himself in an effort to erase my very existence. The Flash pulled me from the timeline. He held me captive for months and when I finally got loose, I found myself pursued by something."
This dialogue seems to suggest that the time wraiths started coming after Thawne immediately after "Flashpoint" in 2000 as opposed to coming after him in 15 years later after Eddie commited suicide -- but given that Thawne refers to both "Flashpoint" and "Fast Enough," we have to take that to mean that after "Flashpoint," he resumed his Season 1 role.
However, it would all make a lot more sense if Eobard's dialogue in "Legion of Doom" hadn't referred to "Flashpoint" at all and simply said, "My ancestor killed himself in an effort to erase my very existence. I tried to escape into the Speed Force, but I found myself pursued by something."
I think the writers wanted to find some way to refer to connect this Thawne to when we'd last seen him in "Flashpoint," hence the awkward reference, but this Thawne is clearly meant to be the post-2015 Thawne of "Fast Enough," not the 2000 Thawne of "Flashpoint." Maybe the dialogue is strange because as a time traveller, Thawne has a weird sense of cause and effect?
3,689 2017-03-15 19:22:34
Re: Marvel Cinematic Universe by Slider_Quinn21 (934 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
To be fair, everything in the MCU looks terrible to Informant and he hated CIVIL WAR which the rest of us liked, so that just indicates that Marvel's maintaining their baseline of quality.
3,690 2017-03-15 17:45:15
Re: Random Thoughts about TV, Film and Media (698 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
ireactions wrote:I would now like Slider_Quinn21 to chime in and say these novels aren't canon.
Well, is any of this technically canon after the reboot?
(I know Enterprise takes place prior to Nero's trip back in time, which is the branching point, but I'll point out that if Kirk went to the War memorial and has fond memories of Starfleet, that doesn't necessarily fit in with the Kirk from the reboot.)
Kirk's father (dead as of the 2009 reboot) appears in the memorial sequence. The novel was written well before the 2009 movie, shortly after the ENTERPRISE finale. That said, according to Roberto Orci and Alex Kurtzman (screenwriters of the 2009 film), all the original shows and sequels continue to exist in a parallel timeline.
My question is actually different. The Enterprise finale is framed by a story taking place during TNG. The prequel novel is framed by a story taking place in the context of TOS. The sequel novel is framed by a story taking place during DS9. Why can't any Enterprise conclusion just be an Enterprise story?
I think that because "These are the Voyages" set up the theme of a framing sequence, LAST FULL MEASURE and THE GOOD THAT MEN DO, in blatantly overwriting it, got some mileage out of maintaining the motif of a framing sequence even as they rewrote Trip's death into a cunning ruse.
I thought that having Jake and Nog appear was actually a really effective touch by retroactively placing the characters of ENTERPRISE into the well-known history of the DS9 characters, and having them discuss the events of the ENTERPRISE finale really emphasized how, as that episode featured a holodeck simulation, nothing in that episode could be trusted. It was a way to make the retcon convincing.
3,691 2017-03-15 15:34:27
Re: Random Thoughts about TV, Film and Media (698 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
How Trip Tucker Died and Got Better
The ENTERPRISE novel, LAST FULL MEASURE, released after the cancellation, has a framing sequence in which a five year old James Kirk is visiting the Starfleet War Memorial and meets an old man who shares little Jimmy's reverence for Starfleet's ideals. We then go into the main story which is set during Season 3 of ENTERPRISE and is an untold adventure of Enterprise investigating the Xindi threat. When we return to the framing sequence at the end, the narration reveals that the old man is Trip Tucker, decades older than he was in his reported death in "These are the Voyages."
With the sequel, THE GOOD THAT MEN DO, a framing sequence has Jake and Nog hanging out and doing some research for one of Jake's books. Jake has stumbled across a strange cover-up; historical records have been altered with regards to the build-up to the Romulan War and the intial formation for the Coalition of Planets. Jake and Nog realize that all this has been done to falsify the death of Charles Tucker III.
We go back to the events of "These Are The Voyages" where we get the full story that exposes the holodeck simulation as a fraud. Tucker is recruited by Section 31 to prevent a Romulan attack and is forced to fake his own death to go undercover. THE GOOD THAT MEN DO also highlights how, when leading up to Trip's death scene in the aired episode, Trip winked at Archer and Archer smiled and then buried the smile, and then Archer gave Phlox a conspiratorial look.
I have no idea if the actors or directors or whoever were deliberately seeding the idea that this entire situation was a ruse or if the editors chose a take where the performers broke character or if Jolene Blalock got everyone high before filming, but it's onscreen and novelists Andy Mangels and Michael Martin seized on that. Good.
Trip is separated from his crewmates and becomes a pivotal figure in the ongoing ENTERPRISE novel series as the Romulan War alluded to in the original TREK becomes the center of the story.
I would now like Slider_Quinn21 to chime in and say these novels aren't canon.
**
With regards to Roddenberry's vision -- what stands out to me is that the original STAR TREK had Kirk and McCoy regularly blowing up and arguing and Kirk was a man of sexual appetites. Spock was certainly a breakout character with his value system, impeccable morality and cool, scientific personality and he contrasted well with his more human co-stars.
Then in the 70s, Spock's status as the breakout character of the show caused Roddenberry to take the view that Spock's philosophies were completely universal for every single character in TREK. Roddenberry seemed to forget that Kirk and McCoy and Scotty and Sulu and Chekov hadn't been anything like Spock. And while after the first TREK film, Roddenberry was relieved of control, he was responsible for THE NEXT GENERATION's first two seasons and its clumsy, witless, lecturing tone.
Writers like Ronald D. Moore and Michael Piller worked within the restrictions. Piller wrote a script where a boy grieves his dead mother. Roddenberry rejected it; people in the 24th century (or Spock) wouldn't grieve death. Piller rewrote it so that the aliens who accidentally killed mom try to push the kid into grief in an effort to atone for their error and his loss. This was accepted.
DS9 found other ways to be get around the limitations, mostly by indicating that the perfect world Roddenberry imagined was merely the Federation and by situating DS9 in proximity to Bajor and Cardassia, DS9 could bypass Roddenberry's restrictions while respecting their values.
They did introduce Section 31, the Federation's black-ops assassins. However, they also made sure to leave themselves some wiggle room by noting that Section 31 is unsanctioned with no official status and could arguably be considered a rogue organization that isn't part of Gene Roddenberry's perfect Federation.
If Ronald D. Moore and Ira Steven Behr had not felt a duty to be follow the letter of the law laid down by the original creator, I imagine they would have gone so far as to say that Gene's values were just that -- values -- existing in contast to a more complicated reality. But as STAR TREK had really put forth an ideal world as an actual reality, I think they felt it best to stick with that for the Federation while noting that there were lots of exceptions in the margins and outside the UNFP -- and they could do morally ambiguous worlds on their own shows.
And I think that's the best route because we should not make STAR TREK more like our world. We should make our world more like STAR TREK. But we also shouldn't be so reverential to a very flawed TV creator that we don't dare step outside his many arbitrary and asinine limitations, and then like Berman and Braga, lose any sense of how to tell a story with conflict, drama, risk, meaning and something to say.
3,692 2017-03-14 17:52:48
Re: Random Thoughts about TV, Film and Media (698 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
It's scary that Informant just randomly BSed precisely how Trip came back to life in the novels.
**
VOYAGER and ENTERPRISE were very weird shows in the sense that they were incredibly awkward, akin to a church sermon from an athiest. I think I know why. Michael Piller, in his FADE IN retrospective, talks about how Gene Roddenberry had a lot of rules for the STAR TREK universe (no conflict, no insecurities, no arguments) and how all this was to propogate Roddenberry's values of a better world. Piller, while struggling with writing drama within those constraints, understood Roddenberry's vision and could present its values.
The latter showrunners, Rick Berman and Brannon Braga, however, didn't understand Roddenberry's values at all. And that's understandable in that as religions go, STAR TREK was a shallow, contradictory mess of self-delusional nonsense at times, but Berman and Braga would mimic Roddenberry's tenets (no conflict, no insecurities, no arguments) without any real heart or conviction in the beliefs behind the words. That's why STAR TREK became such an awkward, remicrowaved reheat of Roddenberry's greatest hits with the last two shows, INSURRECTION and NEMESIS.
3,693 2017-03-14 15:46:34
Re: Random Thoughts about TV, Film and Media (698 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
#24 - 25 are shockingly good comics. You'd kind of expect them to be like pretty much every SLIDERS in Season 6 fanfic ever written where resurrections are being pulled out of thin air with contrivances and grand threats are wiped away due to authorial fiat with no sense of cause and effect. But in this case, it would be a bit like first writing 'missing adventures' set during Seasons 1 -5 to seed plot devices needed for a Season 6 that would then have a foundation for resurrecting Quinn, Wade and Arturo and reuniting them with Rembrandt.
A similar approach was taken with the ENTERPRISE novels, which picked up after the fourth and final season killed off an apparently popular character, the engineer, Trip Tucker. (I found him kind of bland like most of the cast, but it seems the actor was popular?)
A post-show novel, LAST FULL MEASURE, was set during Season 3, but the ending is set after Season 4 and reveals that Trip is alive. THE GOOD THAT MEN DO then provides the full story on Trip's resurrection and it could have come off as unconvincing, but LAST FULL MEASURE hits you really hard with the shocking and joyful reveal of Trip being alive and that creates sufficient build-up for THE GOOD THAT MEN DO to sell you on the character's return.
That said, those two novels were official publications. It reflects terribly on the NINJA TURTLES comics that they had an unpaid fan commission artists and writers to finish what the publisher abandoned. I'm starting on Volume 4 of the series and it too is incomplete and finished by this same Andrew Modeen fellow, which strikes me as crassly unprofessional. And it's also amusing that Modeen was not satisfied with finishing NINJA TURTLES on his own time and money once; he felt compelled to do it twice.
3,694 2017-03-13 19:48:41
Re: Random Thoughts about TV, Film and Media (698 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
In the first issue of Volume 3, Raphael gets shot in the face and is hideously scarred on one side and loses an eye while Splinter and Donatello are abducted by a crime boss seeking to create mutagen-enhanced soldiers. The, Go Komodo, also has cyborg henchmen and in a helicopter fight, Donatello and one of the cyborgs fall. The cyborg is killed, Donatello's shell is cracked and he's dying, and the cyborg, made of living metal, shifts to Donatello in an attempt to preserve its own life, in the process saving Donatello's life as well, although he's now half-robot. It's explained that the mutagen in Donatello's blood has caused the living metal to mutate as well.
... it occurs to me typing this now that there appeared to be no explanation for where this technology came from, although there'd been quite a few visits from aliens in Volumes 1 - 2 and people were always trying to reverse-engineer the tech. Ah, comics. As for Leonardo, one of Go Komodo's komodo dragons is mutated and bites Leonardo's hand off.
Michelangelo isn't dating a human, he's dating an alien-human hybrid named Horridus who works on the Chicago police force. Horridus was a character in Image's SAVAGE DRAGON and when Mirage reclaimed the NINJA TURTLES rights, SAVAGE DRAGON couldn't wrap up the Michelangelo/Horridus romance and it seemed forgotten. Volume 4 didn't acknowledge it.
#24 - 25 have an interesting way to wrap up this unfinished plot: #24 notes that Michelangelo is in New York dealing with all the mutilations of his brothers while writing a romance novel based on his story with Horridus, but Horridus is in Chicago and their long distance relationship, while important to Mikey, is fading out for Horridus. #25 has Horridus say she's in love with the Savage Dragon and Mikey, heartbroken, throws out his typewriter. This neatly addresses why Mikey's writing ambitions, developed in Volumes 1 - 3, aren't mentioned in Volume 4 at all.
3,695 2017-03-13 14:39:41
Re: Random Thoughts about TV, Film and Media (698 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
On NINJA TURTLES, retroactive continuity and what TV Tropes called Arc Welding (declaring stories intended to be separate to have been linked the entire time):
Volume 3 of NINJA TURTLES isn't bad. The artwork is way too busy for a black and white comic and physically mutilating three-quarters of the cast gets pretty over the top when after Donatello's become a cyborg and Raphael's lost an eye, it's followed up with Leonardo losing a hand.
Raphael becoming the Shredder and trying to steer the Foot into a heroic direction is a pretty cool storytelling decision. But then the series abruptly cuts off with #23 and a truckload of unfinished plots: a mysterious Lady Shredder beats Raphael in a duel and takes control of the Foot Clan while Leonardo finds himself struggling to use a prosthetic hand in combat. A lady Foot soldier has joined the Turtles, a villain is attacking Splinter psychically. Casey Jones' daughter is being targeted by a mob boss. Michelangelo has started dating a Chicago police officer.
And then Volume 3 got cancelled and when the series came back with Volume 4 and TURTLES co-creator Peter Laird, Laird ignored Volume 3 completely. So, when the fan-writer Andrew Modeen decided to do his fan-published issues of #24 - 25, he wanted to (a) resolve all these plots and (b) transition smoothly into the already underway Volume 4. This left him with a massive task list to fulfill in two issues.
In order to resolve all this stuff, #24 - 25 refers to stories that were published *after* Volume 3 but are chronologically before Volume 3. Volume 4 of NINJA TURTLES was set 20 years after the original series, but there was an anthology title, TALES OF THE TMNT, which had stories set at various points in the Turtles' timeline. There was also a mini-series called DONATELLO: THE BRAIN THIEF and #24 - 25 draws upon both to conclude Volume 3.
TALES OF THE TMNT had a number of issues where the Turtles were menaced by different female ninjas of unknown origins. #24 - 25 reveals that these different ninjas were all the same woman; they were all the Lady Shredder who attacked Raphael and took over the Foot in #23, and stitches together all these different characters into one role, sparing #24 - 25 the need to create a whole new character from scratch in presenting its central villain who turns out to be the original Shredder's consort. As a result, what could have felt rushed and random in #24 - 25 now feels prepared and considered.
There's a hilarious level of improvisation here in that the TALES writer had no intention of the different lady ninjas all being the same character or the Lady Shredder of Volume 3 -- but it works.
THE BRAIN THIEF, published during Volume 4 and set before Volume 3, had Donatello fighting the cybernetic villain, Baxter Stockman, and imprisoning the Stockman cyborg in a secret lab. In #24 - 25, Donatello, now a cyborg himself, has started to malfunction and he goes to this secret lab to see Stockman for help.
Stockman, intrigued by Donatello's technology, explains that all the Turtles have a healing factor that will allow them to repair any injury but the cyborg machinery is suppressing Donatello's regenerative capacities and the conflict is causing the malfunctions. Stockman helps remove the cybernetic implants to learn more about the tech and Donatello's body, having been trying to heal itself for a year, finally reforms completely.
This sets up the Turtles' healing factor. And then in the final battle with Lady Shredder, the Turtles are on the ropes until a restored Donatello comes to their rescue and during the fight, Leonardo's hand regrows (which is why the prosthetic kept falling off) and it turns out Raphael's eye has also been healed for some time under the eyepatch/Shredder helmet he'd been wearing and he didn't realize it until now.
This, again, is a very effective use of a different story to resolve a present story. #24 - 25 use the BRAIN THIEF mini-series bring Baxter Stockman into the story to explain how the Turtles have regenerative powers (which is actually supported by how they healed up from so many injuries in Volumes 1 - 2). The Turtles all being shown to recover from their mutilations inside the same issue at the same time is ridiculously convenient yet strangely heartfelt and emotionally convincing.
I should really track down this Andrew Modeen figure; we'd have so much to talk about.
3,696 2017-03-12 10:48:53
Re: Marvel Cinematic Universe by Slider_Quinn21 (934 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
THOR is a perfect movie, a cinematic achievement unmatched and unparalleled by any. Why? Because it had Einstein Rosen Bridges and a restaurant called Arturo's. I also loved AMAZING SPIDER-MAN because Andrew Garfield was playing the perfect Quinn Mallory. That's right. I evaluate films entirely in terms of how much they remind me of SLIDERS. :-D
3,697 2017-03-08 20:00:53
Re: Random Thoughts about TV, Film and Media (698 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
I still think SMALLVILLE was too emo and whiny, albeit in an emo and whiny era of TV shows that were all about pretty white people looking sad about their miniscule emotional problems.
**
How old should Angel from BUFFY THE VAMPIRE SLAYER look? How old should the artists draw him in the current in-continuity comics? I realized today that the artists are all over the place, using reference photos from a vast span of time in which David Boreanaz changed a lot.
It's impossible to stop an actor from aging even if David Boreanaz was playing an immortal vampire. From an in-universe standpoint, Angel should look like a 27-year-old Boreanaz and shouldn't ever age. In actuality, Boreanaz seemed to have aged 20 years over the course of his nine years on television as Angel. In-universe, the show doesn't acknowledge that Angel looks older and he gets older even in flashbacks. The lean, fresh-faced youth of BUFFY's first season had become a middle-aged and physically bloated figure by the final episode of ANGEL.
None of this is Boreanaz' fault. He looks consistent enough in his first three years on BUFFY and the first season of ANGEL. In Season 2 of ANGEL, he starts to fill out; the lines in his face are deepening and he's putting on weight. However, that weight is primarily muscle and Boreanaz in Seasons 2 - 3 has gone from lean and cadaverous to buff and ripped; it doesn't look like Angel's getting older, it looks like he's been working out a lot. And it looks terrific in the absurd superhuman action sequences; Angel has become a seemingly unstoppable warrior.
In Season 4, Boreanaz' muscle definition is suddenly gone and he looks fat. Boreanaz' wife had given birth and he wasn't working out because he was up all night with his baby. In-universe, it sort of works in that much of Angel's persona -- the long coat, the convertible car, the spiked hair -- is a constructed image to conceal his insecurities, so as Angel adapted to a more familial environment, he might have become less concerned with his appearance and the character, having become the father figure of the series, is starting to look like one too.
Where it doesn't work, however, is in the action sequences: Boreanaz is simply unable to sell the superhuman side of Angel and it's only when he gets back in shape in the middle of the season does it become visually convincing again that Boreanaz is a superhuman vampire.
In Season 5, Boreanaz starts out in shape, but the makeup artists have stopped smoothing out his complexion and you can see the weathering of his skin where it used to be hidden under concealer. It's fine in that Angel's character is feeling somewhat worn down by circumstances, but in the middle of Season 5, Boreanaz starts to get fat again. The reason: he hurt his knee and needed surgery. This led to many episodes where Boreanaz had to be filmed sitting in a chair and also, he couldn't exercise. As a result, Angel looks hopelessly out of shape in his series finale.
There's not a lot Boreanaz could have done about the situation. The comics seem to primarily draw upon the ANGEL in Season 3 publicity photos as reference, although occasionally, I see a cover that's using Season 1 photos and it's shocking to see Angel looking so young and trim when most artists use a mid-point average.
From a writing standpoint -- I think ANGEL should have written in an explanation for Angel aging by Season 3 once they realized the show was going to continue and that Boreanaz wasn't someone who will physically stay the same. I think I would have liked Season 3 to have an arc where Angel discovers he isn't healing instantly the way he used to. Meanwhile, Fred notices that Angel looks much younger in some old photos even though he shouldn't age. It's revealed: Angel's time in hell damaged his physiology and caused him to start aging and the trip to Pylea where he transformed back and forth between a human and purely vampiral state has worsened his condition. He's now aging faster, using his powers will hasten his degeneration and even if he didn't, he has about a year left to live.
I would probably make this a short arc where Angel becomes desperate to tie up every loose end in his life before he dies, racing the clock, getting weaker (and older) with each adventure, urgently trying to achieve every bit of redemption he can before he dies -- and I would end the arc with Angel being healed through some magic that, however, leaves him aging at a human rate and allows David Boreanaz to age in the role. We would have to give up the flashbacks, though.
When the ANGEL comics started, it was revealed that Angel had become human and was using magic to fake his vampire powers. But eventually, Angel regains his vampire powers. If it had still been a TV show, it probably would've been best to let Angel stay human-ish.
3,698 2017-03-06 16:29:40
Re: Random Thoughts about TV, Film and Media (698 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
Slider_Quinn21 says he has never read a NINJA TURTLES comic. I have recently (re)read a ton of the original Mirage-published ones and I suggest that he never start. The Mirage-published TMNT comics are some of the most incompetent comic books I've ever read.
NINJA TURTLES begins as a deadly serious story of bloody vengeance where the Turtles hunt down and murder their father's sworn enemy, the Shredder -- and all this is clearly a mockery of (a) Frank Miller's grim and gritty style on DAREDEVIL and RONIN (b) the emotional antics of the X-MEN spinoff title, THE NEW MUTANTS and (c) the anthropomorphic pig of CERBERUS. It's a joyless exercise in grimdark -- or it would be except the lead characters were highly skilled ninjas who were giant-sized turtles and this whole thing is clearly a joke.
It was designed as a single-issue gag comic and I can only imagine how writer-artists Kevin Eastman and Peter Laird reacted when their creation became a bestselling independent comic that led to merchandising deals, toys, appareil and a children's cartoon as well as the need for more issues.
Reading the comics after #1, there's a lot of problems here. There's tension between the two co-creators in that Eastman likes intense action and fast pacing whereas Peter Laird likes sedate conversation and moody contemplation and there's an awkward contrast between the two.
There's desperation: in the need to do more issues of a single joke, Eastman and Laird start throwing in random ideas and have the Turtles confronting evil robots, kidnapped to alien planets, meeting time travellers -- none of which speak to the Turtles as characters or find any central themes for the series.
There's also serious visual and scripting problems: it's almost impossible to tell the Turtles apart. They're drawn identically. They have no distinct characterization in these comics. Outside of a one-issue joke, Eastman and Laird don't know who the Turtles are.
The interesting thing is that the cartoon addressed all of these problems: the cartoon universe is a superhero reality of crazy and offbeat concepts where robots and aliens fit right in with the Turtles. The cartoon Turtles are broadly characterized with one core trait for each (the strategist, the tech wizard, the combative one and the prankster). The Turtles each wear a different colour bandana so you can tell them apart. And the different characterizations let you do both the intense action (not that the cartoon could get as bloody as the comics) and the contemplative philosophical stories (not that the cartoon could attempt mood and atmosphere like the comics) as well as the comedy tales.
With the comics, there seems to be (one-sided) conflict against the cartoon. The comics, a noir-exercise in savage intensity and philosophical ponderings seems enraged by the lighthearted cartoon series. The comics coldly refuse to integrate any of the cartoon's solutions nor do they attempt alternative methods.
As a result, the comics are actually the weakest incarnation of the Turtles because Eastman and Laird have a severely undercooked concept that they refuse to develop in order to serve an ongoing series. Their artistry is beautiful, their action sequences are riveting, but without clear characterization, reading these comics is like examining rough storyboards for an animated series.
I've read 75 issues of NINJA TURTLES (volume 1 - 2) and the comic Turtles remain ciphers. I still can't tell them apart and as much as I enjoy the ninja action and the stunning atmosphere, the lack of relatable characters is a crippling flaw.
In the issues I haven't gotten to re-reading yet, poor consideration is matched with the failure to finish stories. Volume 3 was cancelled incomplete: TMNT fan Andrew Modeen had to commission writers and artists to engineer a fan-made conclusion.
Eastman will quit the franchise after this, robbing the comics of his action sensibilities and leaving us with Peter Laird's slow, monotonous pacing and apparent inability to wrap anything up. Despite retaining the rights to publish 18 NINJA TURTLES comics a year after selling the franchise to Viacom, Laird has allowed Volume 4 of TMNT to stall at #32. The anthology series, TALES OF THE TMNT, has also languished incomplete. And once again, Andrew Modeen commissioned a graphic novel, TMNT: ODYSSEY, to serve as a distant finale to the unfinished Volume 4 arc. That's right -- TMNT needed an unpaid fan wrap it all up for them not once but twice.
The incompetence of the Mirage TMNT comics is staggering: they can't develop their series beyond a one-issue joke despite numerous adaptations blazing that trail. They can't design their lead characters so that you can distinguish one from the other. They can't complete their own comic book storylines and need the fans to do it for them.
I'd say that the best incarnation of TMNT is the Nickoledeon CG series which ably captures both the goofy humour of the 80s cartoon and the capacity for hyperactive action and thoughtful contemplation as seen in the comics, but the original comics are a witless exercise in ineptitude and at best historical curiosities.
3,699 2017-03-05 10:38:10
Re: Random Thoughts about TV, Film and Media (698 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
So, I read the Kevin Smith issues of GREEN ARROW. They're good and reflect an interesting approach: Smith doesn't attempt to write an entry-level story. Most 90s era comics were impenetrably linked to previous continuity with every story a sequel and with superfluous references to issues from years and decades past. Most modern superhero comics try to restrict continuity references to joking references and focus on doing new stories unconnected to old ones, allowing for self-contained trade paperback sales.
Kevin Smith found a strange middle ground where he's constantly referring to the past, but doing so in a way that suggests a vast and labyrinth sense of history to Green Arrow that the reader doesn't need to know in order to appreciate. A bit like how the first STAR WARS film suggests a vast interstellar tapestry that wasn't shown onscreen.
Smith resurrects Oliver Queen -- but this is the Oliver Queen of the 70s who is completely confused by the 2001-DC Universe and is baffled by a Flash and Green Lantern who aren't the ones he knew. Smith uses Oliver's confusion to justify expository dialogue and make him as much a newcomer as any new reader might be, allowing the storyline to build from past storylines like CRISIS, ZERO HOUR and FINAL NIGHT, and since Oliver has lost his memory of those stories, readers who don't know them won't be confused either.
Smith also finds a neat way to do a reversal of the definitive Grell-era: Smith's GREEN ARROW is a crazy superhero comic with Oliver feeling like he's awakened in a universe that's completely insane and he's trying to deal with it on a street-crime level. In Smith's hands, GREEN ARROW is an absurdist superhero comedy and it really works.
3,700 2017-03-03 22:16:10
Re: Personal Status Updates! (759 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
I can be a bit obsessive compulsive about my gadgets. I put tempered glass on my smartphone and put a plastic case around it, thinnest I can find on eBay or Amazon. My tablet is sheathed in a matte anti-glare protector and a bumper case. My Surface 3 laptop is protected in the same way -- except the plastic shell case cracked in the upper right and left corners. Given that both corners cracked, I think it’s a design flaw in the case. There aren’t a lot of other Surface 3 case options. The kickstand’s hard to encase without impeding.
The only other case options for the Surface 3 besides this flawed design that’s prone to breaking is the full body skin -- a transparent and protective film that can protect devices from scratches (but not impact damage), is very expensive and after a few months, it starts to peel off at the edges which makes it kind of a ripoff.
Anyway. I bought a three dollar zipper sleeve for the laptop. It’ll protect it during travel. I imagine the laptop will start sustaining scuffs. I accept it. At least the screen’s protected.
3,701 2017-02-28 16:34:32
Re: Random Thoughts about TV, Film and Media (698 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
Surf Dance Chris wrote:Wow, I never heard of or thought about the rigging the timer so they go back to all the worlds they had visited in order to get back to earth prime possibility. That sounds like a great "last season"!
It wasn't a final season - it was a story Torme was working on for Earth Prime that never materialized. He references it in the final lines of this interview:https://earthprime.com/interviews/tracy-torme-2009
And yet, curiously, the interview ends with linking to a completely different Tracy Tormé story in a rather misleading fashion! Bwahahahahahahahahah!
From http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Green_Arrow_(Oliver_Queen)
Hal Jordan (during his time as Parallax) returned to save the earth during the Final Night and used his godlike powers to bring his old friend back from the dead.
I haven't read the Oliver Queen resurrection issues yet, but I find it amusing to observe that the FINAL NIGHT storyline took place thirteen months after GREEN ARROW #100 - 101, meaning Oliver Queen was retroactively resurrected about a year after he was killed off. I also find it quite funny to note that Oliver's death was in a massive explosion from which no body could be recovered -- which strikes me as writer Chuck Dixon knowing Oliver wouldn't stay dead and helpfully making sure there's no body.
I wonder why Smith felt the need to go the route he did of having Hal Jordan revive a corpse given that the simplest explanation would've been that Oliver was somehow extracted from the plane before it exploded.
But it's also funny -- Oliver was supposed to have been resurrected in 1998 at the end of Connor's run as the lead in GREEN ARROW. By that, I mean that the GREEN ARROW series ended on the cast discovering that Oliver Queen, thought dead, is somehow alive. But Kevin Smith is such a slow and lazy writer that DC refused to start having his scripts drawn and printed until they had received multiple scripts and Oliver's resurrection was delayed to 2001, meaning that for three years, Oliver wasn't dead -- just late.
SPIDER-MAN UNLIMITED #18 isn't a great comic, but it has a hilarious scene where the Daily Bugle's obituary writer grumbles at how he is constantly writing retractions due to the constant resurrections.
Anyway. Readers of SLIDERS REBORN will know that I love Comic Book Death and shamelessly ripped off the death and resurrection of Jason Todd to resurrect Wade.
3,702 2017-02-26 22:09:18
Re: Random Thoughts about TV, Film and Media (698 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
So, the first year of Oliver Queen dead and Connor Hawke as the lead of GREEN ARROW -- it's good. Writer Chuck Dixon and artists Rodolfo Damaggio and Will Rosado have achieved a similar hard-boiled action tone to Mike Grell, but with slightly more fantasy elements and the setup is simply Connor travelling the world encountering deadly situations while trying to figure out how to follow in his father's footsteps. Terrific action sequences, a fun sidekick in Connor travelling with Eddie Fyers, an Oliver Queen villain who eventually became a frenemy and who, in the aftermath of Oliver's death, has become a friend. It's funny and action packed. It's a great exploration of Oliver Queen's legacy.
But one wonders why they killed Oliver at all. If they were looking for a break from the Mike Grell era, why not have Oliver wander the world with his son Connor? If they wanted a mentor figure for Connor, why not have Oliver in that role? Why not use the father-son dynamic to give the series a new angle that would be a development on the urban-hunter of Seattle era? Why would you kill off your lead character just because you had a year of bad issues from a bad writer?
Did they seriously think Oliver Queen wouldn't come back? This is comics, for God's sake. These Connor Hawke comics are a great writer executing a baffling editorial mandate.
3,703 2017-02-26 13:00:42
Re: Random Thoughts about TV, Film and Media (698 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
I've been reading GREEN ARROW comics, another iconic figure who went through an awkward age.
Green Arrow is amusing in that, like Iron Man, Captain America and Thor, he was strictly a B-list character for most of his lifetime and in fact, considering Oliver Queen a B-lister may have been overly generous. He was a Golden Age Robin Hood knockoff whose gimmick was trick arrows -- boxing glove arrows, net arrows, etc. -- he was simply an interchangeable back row member of the Justice League. He didn't even get his own title until 1987 and it's only at this point that Green Arrow became an A-list character thanks to writer/artist Mike Grell.
Mike Grell reinvented Green Arrow as an urban hunter of criminals and carefully sidestepped all the fantasy elements of the DC Universe, instead having Oliver fight street gangs and corporate villains and corrupt government officials. Grell's 83 issues kept Oliver strictly in the real world and avoided any crossover interaction, building a universe of shady espionage agents and assassins and defining Oliver as a street level character who was significantly more human than other comic book vigilantes. At the start of Grell's run, Oliver is over-40 and the aches and pains of his career are starting to wear down on him. He's settled into a relationship with Black Canary. He's lost his fortune and expects to wind down and run a flower shop with the Canary -- except the world keeps calling on him to battle injustice and Oliver thrives on hunting.
This hard-boiled, ripped from the headlines approach to Oliver created a template where he could be the star rather than a superhero with no superpowers who was always overshadowed by the rest of the Justice League. A lot of what made it work was Mike Grell's writing style where he scripted silence, space and devised layouts for artists to make the GA comics a stunning work of visual art. Grell became synonymous with GREEN ARROW -- which was a problem when he decided to move on after a six year run of 83 issues in addition to annuals and a mini-series.
The post-Grell issues reflect a terrible confusion. DC editorial promoted from within, hiring editor Kevin Dooley to become the new writer, and Dooley's writing came off as amateur and unprofessional compared to Grell's. Where Grell's every image and moment was infused with meaning, Dooley wrote interchangeable fight scenes guest-starring the superheroes and supervillains that Grell had locked out of his own run. Dooley accomplished little beyond plunging Green Arrow back into the fantasy superhero adventures and made it quite clear why Grell had avoided them. This ghastly follow-up to a seminal and beautiful run was a critical and financial disaster.
At this point, DC apparently decided that Oliver Queen didn't work. The idea of hiring a more competent, visually oriented writer who understood the medium was apparently not considered; DC had a strange attitude of blaming characters for the creators' lack of ability at the time.
While they did hire more capable writers anyway in Kelley Puckett and Chuck Dixon who immediately raised GREEN ARROW's writing quality from awkwardly incompetent to professional, DC wanted sharper measures. Puckett and Dixon successfully blended a version of Grell's hard-boiled approach with some fantasy elements -- but DC felt it would be best to kill off Oliver Queen and replace him with his son, Connor Hawke, create some buzz, bring in new readers and keep the Green Arrow brand going with a character they felt might be an improvement.
The Chuck Dixon written issues in which Oliver dies are very well-written: Oliver goes undercover to join some eco-terrorists, is sympathetic to their cause but then turns on them when they want to drop a bomb over Metropolis. Superman flies onto the plane and discovers Oliver has re-directed the plane and sabotaged the trigger mechanism, but gotten his arm stuck. Removing his arm will destroy the city.
And then Superman decides he'll cut off Oliver's arm. Free him from the bomb. Fly him away from the plane and save him. But Oliver, refusing to lose the archer's arm that gives his life meaning, makes sure the plane is clear of the city and triggers the explosion, dying to save Metropolis and Superman floats helplessly in the explosion, unable to save his friend.
It's perfect. It's beautiful. It's also unbelievable stupid on DC's part. The egotistical, small-minded thinking there is just shocking: this Kevin Dooley guy, a mediocre to terrible writer, has written mediocre to terrible Oliver Queen comics! Clearly, Oliver Queen sucks and we should get rid of him. The fact that they actually got some decent writers after Dooley makes it even sadder and more unnecessary.
Oliver Queen was dead and... to be honest, it wasn't really a big deal. Mike Grell had been the selling point of GREEN ARROW, not Green Arrow, so a new guy with the same name didn't exactly irritate the readers as much as you'd think. It was a pre-ARROW age, after all.
Oliver was absent from 1994 - 2002 and those eight years may have been a good thing where a character DC didn't know how to handle took a long rest and when he came back, he came back with A-list writer Kevin Smith resurrecting Oliver with fanfare and excitement and a clear role in the DCU as a straightman surrounded by the insanity of a superhero universe. Oliver's appearances on SMALLVILLE exposed him to a wider public, and retroactively, those eight years feel like an epic finish to Ollie's story matched with a period of rest and reconsideration.
But, like I said -- they could have just hired a good writer and a good artist in the first place.
3,704 2017-02-24 09:41:17
Re: Sliders Doc (15 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
Slider_Quinn21 wrote:I think we could get a kickstarter going and then hire a production studio to make it. I don't know if people would be willing to pay for it, but it'd definitely be an interesting documentary, and I bet you could get most of the key players (except for RIP Peckinpah) to participate.
No offense, but you're living in a fantasy world if you think a crowdsourced Sliders documentary is possible. While everyone I know from the show is happy to bullshit about what they remember, they are also quick to admit that they remember next to nothing about the experience.
That, factored with Torme's illness, the spread of the crew to the four corners of the globe, and the cost of such an endeavor, makes it a pipe dream.
Matt Hutaff -- crushing your dreams since 1995!
But clearly, the solution here is to set your sights lower to a more achievable project. The solution is to find an expert on SLIDERS. A figure whom we would all agree is the de-facto authority on the series -- and find some way to offer this person a sum of money -- a grant of sorts -- to fund him while he takes the time out of his life to write a book. An ebook. A behind the scenes tell-all of SLIDERS' production history. A writer friend of mine once described grants such as these as "grocery money" to keep himself while working on projects that had yet to be sold. We would need to offer this individual a grant in exchange for an agreed delivery date and distribution system and he would also need to receive all profits from the publication of the book because he was the one who spent all the time and money and effort hammering behind the scenes tidbits out of SLIDERS production staff and crew members.
But would he do it... ? I don't know. We all serve SLIDERS in our own way; some of us by talking about it, some of us by writing foolhardy 20th anniversary specials that only 23 people will read, and it is arguable that this fine fellow has done his work, put as much of it online as he's willing to and we should ask no more of him.
3,705 2017-02-23 18:40:17
Re: Supernatural (267 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
Well, my guess is that the Colt played it's purpose in Kripke's version of the show (killing everything it needed to kill), and when it couldn't kill Lucifer, it was discarded. If you just watch seasons 1-5 (which, in Kripke's mind, is all there is), then it's not really even a plot hole. Whether Bobby has it, Crowley has it, Dean has it, or it's still in that field....Sam is dead and Dean is no longer hunting. Who has the Colt isn't important.
!!!!!!
That makes total sense. Now that you point this out, I didn't even begin my (ridiculous) habit of randomly asking my niece, "Say, whatever happened to the Colt?" until I got into Season 6. I didn't even think about it until about 5 - 6 episodes into Season 6. I'd forgotten in all this wondering that Season 5 had been conceived as the end.
Either way, it's cool that it's back. And I wonder if they'll even worry about filling in the blanks. Will they do a scene re-enacting the attack on Lucifer? Or do we have all they're going to give us?
I think that Crowley having the Colt -- and having been the one who returned it to the boys before they lost it again -- neatly fills that gap, but I guess they could refilm that moment from Season 5. They did de-age Jensen Ackles once and they've got Mark Pellegrino.
Anyway. I think from now on, I will randomly ask my niece, "So, is Ben really Dean's son?" Hopefully, SUPERNATURAL won't take that away from me.
3,706 2017-02-23 16:53:47
Re: Supernatural (267 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
Regarding the Colt: I now wonder if the writers didn't even mean for the Colt to disappear the way it did. In "Abandon All Hope," Dean is still holding the Colt when Lucifer throws him into a tree, but when Sam goes to Dean's unconscious form, the gun is now under Dean's hand; he's not holding it anymore.
Then Dean regains consciousness and Castiel teleports them away. It's not clear if Dean picked up the gun again before Castiel took him away or not, which left it completely possible that the Colt was simply hidden away in Bobby's house, useless in the fight against Lucifer and therefore not on camera. The Colt could have reappeared at any point in the series in the boy's hands and that would have been fine. The writers seemed averse to even speaking of it, leaving it unclear if the boys even had it anymore until "Frontierland," a season later -- when the boys need to go to 1861 to kill a phoenix with the Colt and have to locate the Colt in 1861 -- which indicates that they don't know where the gun is in the present day.
Is it possible that the Colt wasn't meant to be lost, just unused and put away -- but unclear editing left that uncertain, then the long period of time it went unmentioned made it even more ambigous -- and then the writers conceived "Frontierland" which required the Colt be unavailable in the present day?
3,707 2017-02-23 16:34:06
Re: DC Superheroes in Film (1943 - 2024) (1,098 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
Oh, we got Matt Reeves to direct THE BATMAN after all!
3,708 2017-02-22 17:17:07
Re: Random Thoughts about TV, Film and Media (698 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
Well, I always wonder how Sliders would've recovered if Torme had successfully reclaimed the series on Sci-Fi. After watching the end of season 3, would we be happy to get anything featuring the original sliders? Or would Torme's Season 4 feel a little like Supernatural Seasons 6+ without Kripke...a cheap copy of the original (because of the network shift and the smaller budget, not a different creative staff, but you get my point). I also wonder how Torme would've handled Sci-Fi's meddling. If Jerry had pulled the same kind of stunts, would John have been able to talk him down? Would Torme have caved to Jerry's demands? Allowed him to walk like the Season 5 crew did?
This isn't really a hypothetical. Tormé's Season 4 premiere would have been "Slide Effects": Quinn wakes up to find himself home. Time has been rewound to the Pilot: Wade is working at Doppler Computers, Rembrandt is rebuilding his career, the Professor is teaching and the only person who remembers sliding is Quinn.
The scenario is revealed to be a Kromagg trick; the sliders were abducted shortly after the events of "The Guardian" (or "Murder Most Foul" if Tormé is in an especially good mood when writing this script) and put in a dream state experiment. The sliders escape the simulation, find the timer and slide off to new adventures.
If Tormé had been faced with Jerry's contract expiring before Season 5 was ordered -- well, I don't think Jerry would have left; John would have made Jerry stay. That said, Tormé would have been totally capable of writing Quinn out in six episodes and letting the Professor become the new lead character. I can't see Tormé hiring Charlie as a regular nor can I see John permitting Jerry to make that sort of power play, but I can see Charlie being hired as Jerry's photodouble for distance shots, over the shoulder filming and lighting setups.
In terms of writing, I imagine we would have instantly reverted to the Season 1 playbook: highly comedic episodes of satirical charm with a few horror-oriented episodes thrown into the mix. A KKK episode where the Klan is composed of black people. A world where freedom of the press has been obliterated. Worlds where the South won the Civil War, where McCarthyism never ended -- but the budget would have necessitated certain production measures.
Likely, there would have been less location shooting matched with a return to the Vancouver style approach where rather than standing sets, there'd be a studio space where walls, furniture, props and set dressing could be wheeled in and out to make it whatever indoor or outdoor location was called for in the story.
For outdoor locations, the camera angles would be tighter so that there'd be less visible background around the actors and therefore less money spent on building or dressing the location. It's the approach seen in most Season 5 episodes of FRINGE.
Would Tormé's SLIDERS have ended on a cliffhanger? He had lots of ideas for a series finale. One idea he was keen on was to end the show with the sliders rigging the timer to send themselves backwards through the interdimension, encountering the results of their interference on all the Earths they'd seen, running into old friends and enemies, all in the hope that home would be at the end of the trail.
Tormé left it open for himself to decide when the time came if all the sliders would make it home, if some of them would make it. The one idea he was keen on at the time of our discussion: he liked the idea of Wade, Rembrandt and Arturo making it home without Quinn and then giving up home in order to save Quinn and finding themselves all lost once again, and ending the show with the sliders declaring that so long as they are together, they are home.
My favourite ending is the Mike Truman ending of Earth 317 where it's revealed that every decision causes our sliders to split into a parallel version of themselves, and sliders make it home with the timer still counting down. Quinn says even if they choose to leave, they also choose to stay, and with every choice they make, a new universe is born and a new adventure begins.
3,709 2017-02-22 15:52:34
Re: Random Thoughts about TV, Film and Media (698 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
There is something funny about the desire to add more realism to a series about talking humanoid turtles trained in ninjitsu by the giant rat who adopted them as his sons. Fiction isn't realistic; realism is more of an illusion. Some fans think that SLIDERS is more realistic by having so many characters die horribly and that it reflects our reality, but SLIDERS should reflect SLIDERS' reality, not our own.
On SLIDERS' loss of Quinn and the Professor and the Season 4 invasion arc: it came to the forefront of my mind recently because I've been helping with the LOIS AND CLARK REWATCH PODCAST and there's a similar arc. The Season 3 finale is a two-parter that ends with Superman forced to leave Earth to stop an interstellar war. Season 4 opens with another two-parter has Superman absent from Earth when it's invaded by aliens.
If SLIDERS had done something similar with its cast exits and the Kromagg invasion -- Season 3 ends in a two-parter where the Professor is killed, Quinn is lost, Wade and Rembrandt make it home to find it's been invaded by the Kromaggs -- and then Season 4 started with a two-parter where Quinn returns with the Azure Gate Bridge Professor and they successfully liberate home but are lost in the multiverse again in doing so -- it would've worked.
One of the darkest CAPTAIN AMERICA stories was THE DEATH OF CAPTAIN AMERICA where a hypnotized Sharon Carter shoots Cap to death with a special gun from the Red Skull. As Cap is buried, a resurrected Bucky steals Cap's shield and becomes the new Captain America, trying to uncover the Red Skull's plot and identify Cap's killer as civil and political turmoil in America lead to what seems like inevitable destruction.
It was two years of extremely dark storytelling with a few notes of hope as Bucky realizes he can redeem his past as the Winter Soldier by continuing Steve's legacy and he develops a bond with the Falcon. And finally, Steve Rogers comes back.
Steve's death scene didn't have a back door to reverse it as much as a clearly marked fire exit: Sharon was armed with a special gun and not a standard firearm. The big finale, CAPTAIN AMERICA: REBORN (hunnh) reveals that the gun actually ripped Cap out of time and left him unstuck (hunnh) and his friends eventually recover him just in time to stop the Red Skull. Barack Obama pardons Cap for his CIVIL WAR actions. And then Cap declares that he's proud of Bucky and encourages him to remain the new Captain America while Steve decides he can still be a superhero who'll just call himself Steve Rogers.
The death of Captain America was a way to explore what Steve meant to the series through his absence. And the way it ended, it brought back the status quo but gave us a new variation: Bucky as Cap with Steve still active, wearing a new costume (his WINTER SOLDIER outfit with no mask) and using an energy shield while Bucky had the real one. Cap's death left a vacuum in which the Bucky character could truly come into his own. Later, Bucky returned to being the Winter Soldier and the shield returned to Steve, but Bucky's role in the Marvel Universe was now a fixture.
That, to me, is the way to handle this sort of story: the Captain America concept was taken apart, but it wasn't done just to grab attention and for empty shock value, it was so that Cap could be reconstructed with Bucky as part of the regular status quo. Deconstruction is only meaningful if it's followed by rebuilding stronger and better.
3,710 2017-02-21 17:42:30
Re: Timeless (31 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
My niece described TIMELESS to me and I thought -- boy, TIMELESS sounds like the original show of which LEGENDS OF TOMORROW is a shabby ripoff.
3,711 2017-02-21 17:38:42
Re: Random Thoughts about TV, Film and Media (698 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
I've never read a TMNT comic....which is odd because I still have a soft spot for the Turtles. When I read about Volume 3, I sorta loved the ambition. I don't know how "hyperviolent" it was, but if these guys are running up against ninjas....they probably would be pretty brutalized. They'd lose limbs and be seriously injured. Wasn't this also the segment of the comics where Raphael became the Shredder? Was it also the one where aliens came and the Turtles were free to walk around New York freely?
I like when writers get the free reign to take characters to dark places. Where you genuinely don't know what will happen next, and any fight could have serious consequences.
Volume 4 is where the Turtles are now in their 30s and known to the public. Volume 4 ignores Volume 3, although, as I said, the unofficial comics created through the participation of the official writer and artists managed to weld Volume 3 and 4 together. It's that eternal question: does the absence of official sanction from a corporate copyright holder negate the canonicity of material that has been approved by the creators of the property? (Well. It's my eternal question.)
**
I'm all for taking risks with characters and putting them in situations of risk and jeopardy. Even Raphael becoming the new Shredder in Volume 3 is a neat idea. Where I draw the line is changing characters to the point where they're no longer suited to their original purpose because they've been so severely damaged.
NINJA TURTLES is not as lightweight a property as the 1987 cartoon would indicate; the comics can be bloody and violent, but there's also an inherently comedic absurdity in the ridiculous imagery of biped turtles wielding ninja weapons. The design of the Turtles is brilliant because they can be eerily menacing or adorably cuddly. They alternate between the two and it's the same for their stories.
Volume 3 removed this versatility by injuring Leonardo, Donatello and Raphael to the point where you couldn't look at them without being informed of how they'd been mutilated. This alters the Turtles to the point where you don't have the option of doing lightweight comedy with them, you can only do the dark and serious stories now, and the Turtles have become tormented, angsty messes. And the Image comic left the Turtles in this situation with its cancellation, giving the impression that this was permanent.
In truth, Carlson had every intention of walking back from all these changes. If the unofficially official finale to Volume 3 had been published during the original run, it's possible that Volume 3 would have been seen as a disturbing but interesting and well-told experiment that focused on the grimmer Turtles stories before bringing comedy back to the table.
It's a bit like SLIDERS where, if the Kromagg invasion of Earth and the loss of Quinn and the Professor had been story arcs that ended with the status quo restored, it would have been effective and compelling. But presented as the new normal, it just didn't work because it crippled the series. Ongoing series, for better or worse, have a status quo that needs to be maintained. Change needs to be more in terms of incorporating new variations that exist alongside the original rather than removing previously existing possibilities and replacing them with nothing.
3,712 2017-02-20 11:32:11
Re: Supernatural (267 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
I thought it was really sloppy that the Colt, a critical magical object for five seasons, was forgotten with no fanfare and you can't even tell what happened to it onscreen and a media tie in had to establish that Dean dropped it. It's reappearance in the time travel episode was very nice but the boys not discussing its present day location was a glaring omission. There should have at least been one ADR line about how the field had been solo badly torn up by whatever ritual Lucifer enacted that the gun couldn't be found.
3,713 2017-02-20 08:23:10
Re: Supernatural (267 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
The Colt's disappearance was always confusing; Dean shoots Lucifer, it doesn't work, Lucifer throws Dean into a tree and then the Colt isn't seen again except in the past. I always wondered: if Dean dropped it, why didn't the boys go back to the field at some point after Lucifer left or was imprisoned and get the damned demon killing gun back? I imagine that a shot of Dean dropping the gun and failing to retrieve it was cut from the episode due to time constraints.
Two years after the Colt vanished in the fight with Lucifer, HarperCollins published BOBBY SINGER'S GUIDE TO HUNTING in which Bobby says Dean dropped the Colt in the field, everyone ran and no one looked back. But that didn't explain why they didn't go back for it later. This loose end was glaring and yet difficult to address beyond the showrunners feeling that the demon killing knife was sufficient and the Colt made things too easy.
Anyway. This new episode neatly resolves the issue: Dean dropped the Colt, and maybe the boys did go back for it, but Crowley beat them there and reclaimed the gun first.
3,714 2017-02-19 22:06:32
Re: Random Thoughts about TV, Film and Media (698 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
3,715 2017-02-19 21:23:02
Re: DC Superheroes on TV & Streaming (1966 - 2024) (1,683 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
On Dinah Drake:
I thought it was really mean spirited to bring Katie Cassidy back and then reveal it was a fakeout. That said, I have no issue with Dinah Drake as the new Black Canary. When ARROW first started, I never really thought Laurel would become Black Canary. She wasn't the Dinah character from the comics. Admittedly, Oliver isn't the character from the comics either, but Laurel was clearly designed to be a TV version of Katie Holmes' Rachel Dawes from BATMAN BEGINS; the lawyer who doesn't realize her playboy childhood friend is the hero of the series.
I couldn't what this Laurel Lance character, this reserved, thoughtful legislator with addiction issues, had to do with the peppy, vivacious, hyperactive Dinah Lance of the comics. In the comics themselves, Black Canary was originally Dinah Drake, but due to the passage of time and DC's desire to keep Black Canary's World War II history intact, they decided to say that the Golden Age Black Canary was Dinah Drake and the current Black Canary was her daughter, Dinah Laurel Lance. The Sara Lance character was close to Dinah from the comics, but even when Laurel became the Black Canary, she was still Rachel Dawes from the Nolan BATMAN movies.
So, I have no issue with Dinah Drake becoming the Black Canary. That was never Laurel's role; even when she put on the costume, it was more about Sara's legacy than Laurel. It's fine. Still wish they hadn't done the fakeout, though.
3,716 2017-02-19 20:25:00
Re: Random Thoughts about TV, Film and Media (698 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
On the NINJA TURTLES:
This black and white creator owned comic book series shifted to Image Comics for its third volume in the 1990s. The original creators, Kevin Eastman and Peter Laird, were busy with TV shows and merchandising and films at the time and were quite hands off.
Also, Image Comics was quite keen on bloody hyperviolence during this time and they took this approach to the Ninja Turtles: Leonardo's hand got cut off, Raphael's face was mutilated and he lost an eye, Donatello became half-cyborg, Splinter became a bat, and while Ninja Turtles was always much more serious than the cartoons, this savage miseryfest was toxic to fans who didn't enjoy seeing their favourite characters brutalized. Sales were pathetic and the series was cancelled in mid-storyline.
In 2001, one of the original creators, Peter Laird, announced that Volume 4 of NINJA TURTLES would come out under his stewardship. Fans imagined that the original creator wouldn't want to deal with these savaged, twisted versions of his creations and wondered: how would Laird undo all these changes? How would he resurrect Quinn, Wade and the Professor -- I mean, fix the Turtles and Splinter?
Volume 4 opens with the Turtles and Splinter, 15 years after Volume 3 -- and Volume 4 simply acts like Volume 3 never happened. It's not referred to. It's not spoken of. It is not addressed at all. And while some fans were relieved to be able to forget Volume 3 like a bad dream, others were irked that they bought 23 issues that they might as well have never bought.
A fan, Andrew Modeen, felt sad that Volume 3 had no conclusion. He reached out to the Volume 3 writer, Gary Carlson, and discovered that the Volume 3 had been meant to turn away from all the ultraviolent savagery it had fallen into, but the ending had never been published.
Modeen was able to gather a number of artists and get the Carlson to provide his story notes, and Modeen shepherded an unofficial, fan-published two-issue conclusion to Volume 3 with art from veteran NINJA TURTLE artists who donated their labour.
This illustrated fanfic comic sees Splinter restored, Raphael, Donatello and Leonardo healed -- and the ending proceeds to set up the events of Volume 4, transitioning into the subsequent volume seamlessly. These completed issues were put online for free to give the fans an ending and a bridge from Volume 3 to Volume 4. These two issues received rave reviews and are considered two of the best installments of NINJA TURTLES ever made -- and they're not even official.
... wow. Just wow.
3,717 2017-02-19 20:07:17
Re: Supernatural (267 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
My niece is a big SUPERNATURAL fan and for the last three years, every time I see her, I ask for no reason whatsoever, "By the way, did we ever find out what happened to the Colt?" until this constant refrain causes her to throw empty soda cans in my direction while shrieking, "For the last time, no!!!!"
She has expressed tremendous relief that this episode will now prevent me from asking her this question ever again.
3,718 2017-02-19 17:30:28
Re: DC Superheroes in Film (1943 - 2024) (1,098 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
Alright, I've had enough of this. As the moderator, I have decided that some opinions are simply unwelcome and unacceptable. Slider_Quinn21, I forbid you from voicing any further opinions about BATMAN VS. SUPERMAN from this moment forward on this board and declare this ban to exist in perpetuity --
Unless you watch the god-damn Ultimate Edition for goodness' sake we can't have any productive conversation about it until we have a common frame of reference holy S-word I will Paypal you the thirteen bucks for the DVD when will we move on!?
As for Affleck -- I just don't see why anyone would do JUSTICE LEAGUE with Superman, Batman and Wonder Woman but then no Batman. Why do a JUSTICE LEAGUE film series with the trinity if the trinity is to be reduced to a duo? I mean, I guess you could make the movie anyway just as you could keep making SLIDERS without Professor Arturo and do a HARRY POTTER movie without Hermione or a THREE MUSKETEERS movie without D'Artagnan -- but these projects would ultimately be hobbled and crippled.
Yes, the JLA has had periods where Green Lantern and Vixen and Bloodwynd and the D-list were headlining the team, but at the end of the day, films are for a mainstream audience and the version of the JLA embedded in cultural consciousness is Superman, Wonder Woman and Batman -- and that version is not not Kon-El, Donna Troy and Dick Grayson, nor is it John Henry Irons, Hippolyta of Themyscira or Jean-Paul Valley/Terry McGinnis/Jim Gordon. It's Clark, Diana and Bruce. Yes, you could probably film and distribute a JLA movie without Bruce, but wouldn't that defeat the purpose of this series -- which was to have these versions of these icons exist in this consistent and developing continuity?
3,719 2017-02-18 23:24:24
Re: DC Superheroes in Film (1943 - 2024) (1,098 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
My view is that actors matter, people matter, because these are the specific faces and characters we're letting into our hearts. The unprofessional part of Affleck leaving (if he leaves) is that the DCEU is being sold on the strength of Affleck's acting and reputation at this point. They asked their audience to invest in the construction of the DCEU with Affleck as one of the pillars.
And Affleck isn't playing Jimmy Olsen or Chloe Sullivan's street coffee vendor; he is playing Batman. If you're going to have someone play that role that prominently, you should make sure this actor is locked in to play this character long-term and make sure the relationship between the actor and the studio is solid and if you can't do that, find another actor. If Marvel replaced Robert Downey Jr. a few movies in, the MCU would be game over for me too, and that's what I see happening here if Affleck's departure comes to pass.
3,720 2017-02-18 19:01:20
Re: DC Superheroes in Film (1943 - 2024) (1,098 replies, posted in Sliders Bboard)
In my case, I really like the actors and losing Affleck is simply unprofessional especially at this early stage. In the case of the Marvel movies, I missed Edward Norton as Bruce Banner and preferred Terence Howard as Rhodey, but they were used as supporting characters when new actors took over. Affleck is a star and a lead. To lose him at the start is just awkward and embarrassing no matter how anyone may try to spin it.