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I think these comments in red are a little unfair. I posted the correct article with the correct facts. Here is another fact from that same article.

https://www.msnbc.com/top-stories/lates … rcna166247

Fact:

"When Democratic primary voters selected Biden, Harris’ name was attached to his name and they chose her as vice president — you know, the role that takes over for the president if needed. So the argument that the American public did not have a chance to vote for Harris is categorically false. Also, they will have a chance to vote for her, or not vote for her, on Nov. 5."

Here is the proof:

Here is my original fact from that same article, showing exactly what was said, highlighted:

In fact, here's my screenshot with the captions proving that Trump said it on the video linked to...in that same article:

Whether or not a primary was held in 2024 makes no difference, because voters voted for her and she had their backing. If there were to be another candidate chosen, then the Democratic party could have made that happen without much of an issue.

I posted the facts to the article stating that Trump stated this exact same thing.

Here is exactly where Trump states it about Kamala not being voted in by primary on video (also linked to in the article), which is the origin of this lie meant to disenfranchise dem voters:

https://youtu.be/wgdhv1qbA4I?si=FOOLp73 … J&t=60

And I'm sorry, but I think it is a material fact that this particular saying is a lie spread by Trump. You can't say that dems didn't vote for Kamala because that is not what happened. Dems voted for Kamala as part of the President Biden ticket in 2020. The democratic party was free to choose another candidate by primary if they wanted to.

She has been an excellent Vice President, and has 30 years of experience in all three branches of Government. I would say she was an excellent candidate, resulting in one of the smallest popular vote margin wins in history since 2000.

Anyway, my points are correct, and they are in the article. And I posted the correct article with the correct facts backing up my claim.

Now, I'm going to fact check this. From MSNBC.

This is actually a right wing complaint (I am not calling anyone right wingers here, just saying the source of the complaint) that was first screamed about by Trump, so him being a pathological liar, this claim is absolutely not correct.

Debunking Trump's claim that the presidency was 'taken away' from Joe Biden

The U.S. Constitution says nothing about a party's nominating process. But that hasn't stopped Trump from pushing baseless coup claims.

https://www.msnbc.com/top-stories/lates … rcna166247

This is an adapted excerpt from the Aug. 10 episode of "Velshi."

After Donald Trump and his allies spent months dragging President Joe Biden for his age and mental acuity, they appeared to be caught flat-footed when someone younger and sharper took over the ticket.

Now according to Trump, Americans are being ripped off because, get this, the campaign was stolen from Biden.

"The presidency was taken away from Joe Biden and I’m no Biden fan. But I tell you what, from a constitutional standpoint, from any standpoint you look at, they took the presidency away ... For a country with a Constitution that we cherish — we cherish this Constitution — to have done it this way is pretty severe, pretty horrible. You would have thought they would have gone out to a vote, they would have had a primary system, they would have done something but to just take it away from him like he was a child..."

Hearing Trump say that he cherishes the Constitution is pretty rich but this isn’t the first time he's made this claim. Trump has posted on Truth Social alleging, “the Democrats have Unconstitutionally taken a Candidate ... and unceremoniously replaced him with a new Candidate." Team Trump has even likened the whole situation to a "coup."

If you’re like me, you’ve been seeing versions of Trump’s lie all over social media. And maybe hearing it from your conservative uncle who likes to argue during family dinners. I don’t want to give credence to every ridiculous claim Trump throws out but this one seems worth debunking.

So, for fact's sake, the presidency was not taken from Biden. Nor has Vice President Kamala Harris unconstitutionally robbed Biden of the Democratic nomination. In fact, the U.S. Constitution doesn't address the matter of party nomination processes.

Here are some other talking points to politely provide to your extra-loud uncle: Biden won the vast majority of the Democratic delegates during the primary election process and clinched the presumptive nomination back in March. But he was not formally the Democratic nominee — he was the presumptive nominee. This allowed him to, after much consideration, step aside voluntarily. He was not kicked off the party ticket and while the whole gambit might’ve been a politically risky move, there’s nothing illegal about it.

When Democratic primary voters selected Biden, Harris’ name was attached to his name and they chose her as vice president — you know, the role that takes over for the president if needed. So the argument that the American public did not have a chance to vote for Harris is categorically false. Also, they will have a chance to vote for her, or not vote for her, on Nov. 5.

The Democratic Party has a lot of rules in place for a situation as serious as a presidential election. There are rules for this exact scenario. Harris, in order to officially take Biden’s place on the ticket, needed to secure support from at least 2,350 Democratic convention delegates, including those who already pledged their support to Biden, and the elected officials, former presidents and other party elders dubbed the “superdelegates.”

That's an interesting take, ireactions - thank you!! I'll keep it in the back of my mind as a potential something to watch if I'm all out of anything else to watch for a day, or two, or three...

I distinctly remember advertisements for this series. It sure looked interesting at the time and I thought about getting around to watching it, but never did. Ain't no time like the present, I guess...

Can you please quote for me which citizens? I tend to trust the fire authorities stating what I said over citizens who may be vulnerable to right wing lies spread on the social networks.

Also, re: Trump's victory, not according to MSNBC. I certainly mis-stated the information. And for that, I admit I was wrong. I can correct that to: since 2000. There we go.

https://x.com/harryjsisson/status/1859025719827021893

Slider_Quinn21: How much good will do you think that Trump threw away today with all of his executive orders?

My guess: 250%. And then some.

We're not part of the Paris Climate Accords anymore as of today.

Thankfully, at least, the clown is unable to will away birthright citizenship because it is a constitutional right.

God help us all.

Thank you, pilight, for checking in!

Something like this?

Possible episodes in 10-episode season format:

Marvel's What-If Season Something Or Other:

Episode 1: Thanos's Goal: What If Thanos Didn't Get the Infinity Stones?
Episode 2: Gamora's Destiny: What If Thanos Did Not Destroy Her Home Planet?
Episode 3: The Death of Tony Stark: What If Tony Stark Didn't Die in Avengers: Endgame?
Episode 4: Loki's Childhood: What If Loki Remained Part of Jotunnheim?
Episode 5: The Missingvengers: What If The Avengers Never Existed?
Episode 6: Dr. Strangeverse: What If Dr. Strange Didn't Have His Car Accident That Night?
Episode 7: Quinn Mallory meets Tony Stark: A Sliders and Marvel-verse Crossover (this episode would actually turn out to be linked to a malfunction of the time machine Tony Stark created in Avengers: Endgame)
Episode 8: Black Widow's Bite: What If Natasha Romanoff Did Not Become Friends with The Hulk?
Episode 9: Tony Stark's Loss: What If Pepper Died Instead of Becoming Infected with Extremis?
Episode 10: Thanos's Change of Heart: What If Thanos Decided Not to Attack The Statesman and The Asgardians Survived?

Oh yes. I wholeheartedly agree with you, Slider_Quinn.

This is also evident with Google Trends searches for tariffs going up quite a lot after the election.

They all just wanted to "own the libs" regardless of anything else.

And they're gonna pay for it. Good.

I think that by not covering Trump and not pointing out Trump's mental incompetence exactly as they did Biden's 24/7,  actually hurt the democratic campaign more than it helped. In that way, the media is entirely complicit and played a large part in the loss.

About the only station who was only covering everything anti-Trump was MSNBC (sadly).

I'm going to have to retort the Afghanistan negative talking points here with the following facts:

Only 13 American soldiers died.
President Biden saved over 122,000 people from certain death, who were airlifted out of Afghanistan successfully.

I'd call that a successful withdrawal. I'm sorry Americans died. But you can't deny that it was a highly successful withdrawal when it saved over 122,000 lives.

What others fail to say when bringing this up is how badly Trump botched everything when he negotiated with the Taliban.

It is entirely unrealistic and naive to act as if a military operation is going to be all hunky dory and without casualties.

Yep. I recognized this as soon as the media didn't say a single word about Trump being the same age as Biden. He's made far worse senile remarks than Biden ever has, and the media doesn't say a single word? Come on. I fully agree with you there that they are absolutely complicit. And yes, Bezos' actions were completely off the wall.

Today, though...the latest in a string of perverted efforts to destroy our government because to them, they don't want any rules, Elon Musk made a concerted effort to stop the shutdown bill. And it was successful. He successfully shut down a bipartisan bill that Mike Johnson worked with Dems and Republicans on for months to make possible.

Although I am trying to remain optimistic that a last-minute aversion will happen as usual, at this time, I don't know. Government destruction may be coming sooner than anticipated because of President Musk. Many folks on Twitter are referring to Musk as President Musk now, including Bernie Sanders. So, I half-horroredly-jokingly use the term myself.

Trump is not going to like that.

But, it was a joint effort between Musk and Trump to kill the bill to avert the shutdown with multiple comments from Trump and Musk on the social networks. If the government shuts down, many people who are dependent on certain services from the government will not be able to receive them. I realized after I posted previously that people will still be getting their checks, assuming a shutdown doesn't last for long...

From: https://www.brookings.edu/articles/what … other-one/

"Benefits such as Social Security and Medicare continue to flow because they are authorized by Congress in laws that do not need annual approval (although the services offered by Social Security benefit offices may be limited during a shutdown). In addition, the Treasury can continue to pay interest on U.S. Treasury debt on time."

This is, however, going to get bad really fast unless something happens to stop it.

Here are several examples of contradictions and differing opinions on the topic.

Why Democrats Lost in 2024 - Lessons from Phoenix and the Working Class

https://azmirror.com/2024/12/04/why-dem … ing-class/

This one states that the decline in non-college-educated voters were a major reason why Dems lost. Not working class voters. If we're going strictly by education, non-college-educated voters exist in every class. They can't make up a class all by themselves. It almost uses non-college-educated voters and working class interchangeably, leading to the contradiction.

This article makes the point that talking about the working class leaves out a lot of different types of voters, and that we don't talk enough about who makes up the working class when these discussions arise:

What we don’t talk about when we talk about the “working class”

https://www.vox.com/politics/390108/wor … oters-2024

Did Democrats Lose on the Economy or Culture Wars?

https://www.npr.org/2024/11/14/nx-s1-51 … s-weigh-in

In this one, one person says it's the working class. Another person says that party building actually needs to take place. Parts of the working class Dems lost, and others that held strong.

And still in this same article, another person thinks that the overall message of "what have Democrats done for me in the last 4 years" is something that can't be answered by the working-class and middle-class voters, who can't answer this question tangibly - is something that needs to be discussed.

This makes me so freaking happy!!!!!!!!!

OMG.

This post contains SPOILERS for the Superman and Lois series finale....you have been warned before scrolling...

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I finally got the chance to watch the Superman and Lois series finale. I got tears in my eyes. I didn't think it would be possible on a production like this but the writers really went all out and tied up the finale almost perfectly. I would have liked to have seen other characters have more wrap up time (perhaps more focused on Nat and John a bit and others without being super long on the Lana Lang wedding).

I thought it was one of those scenes that you realize Doomsday isn't all a monster. For just a moment we see the real bizarro world Superman emerge as he allows himself to be destroyed by the sun. Finally, he doesn't have to be a monster under Lex's control anymore. It's a scene of mixed relief, sadness, and disappointment that Superman has to die in order for Doomsday to die. And you can see Clark's face as he comes to this realization as well.

Jonathan and Jordan both got some nice upgrades as adults. Watching Lois get her cancer again and die from that was really hard. Did anyone else notice the homage to the Superman original movie (1979) Lois Lane in one of the last scenes where she and Clark are old?

I'm not sure that I like seeing Superman get old. But it sure fits the timeline of this show, which I thought was done well. Superman is a timeless classic hero who is supposed to be eternal. At least for the lifetime of the sun itself. But, with Superman losing his Kryptonian heart, I guess that this is the most logical conclusion. Had the writers had more time they could have given Superman his heart back and returned things back to normal I am sure.  I really do, however, enjoy how it was implemented for Superman and Lois.

The series finale is highly recommended watching and the entire show is highly recommended too, especially if you're at all a fan of Superman.

I can wait and see if some of the dumber ideas get done. But, there have been plenty of signs over the news, hence why I am not very optimistic and why I need to continue to focus on more positive things.

Anyway, for example...

Republicans may not have a choice. Elon Musk has threatened every senator with being primaried if they vote against Trump's cabinet picks.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/trump-team-w … 29118.html

In addition, most of Trump's cabinet picks are either authors of Project 2025 or connected to Project 2025 in some way:

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/202 … picks.html

This is not going to bode well for Ukraine, either. As Trump advisors (as Trump is) are vehemently against NATO and will push for Ukraine to concede territory:

https://www.reuters.com/world/trumps-pl … 024-12-04/

While President Zelensky continues to try and get NATO to provide Ukraine with an INVITE and include all occupied territory, including Crimea. It's not explicitly stated but overtly implied through his "Ukraine must join NATO as an entire country." comments. Will pulling Crimea over the umbrella of a NATO alliance trigger war?

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cn8g8ylvyldo

And you're right. It's not for everybody to not focus on the news. I prefer having at least a basic understanding of everything going on, but at this point, things are happening quite fast and they are evolving rapidly. A brief break for a couple of days would be a good idea for me. But not permanently.

I only hope President Biden and Mark Rutte are able to help get Ukraine into NATO before the current administration ends. And that President Biden's upcoming pardons are sufficient to help protect some from being unfairly targeted by Trump.

Thank you, ireactions. May I please calmly state my piece? I want to apologize. There is no anger in this post about you or your actions, ireactions. I understand why you took the actions you did. But, I have a few points I would like to make. And I will move forward with the topic at hand afterward.

I really was not harassing you, ireactions, on Sunday night when I was legitimately trying to start a conversation. I wasn't just saying that to "weasel out of any behavior."

I also apologize for how you took that republican comment. I could have worded it differently when I initially said it, because I meant what I said about not respecting republicans in general. I did not know you would take it that way. I certainly did not mean, however, for you to take it as an attack on you. And that's the absolute truth. I know you are not a republican, and I would never call you that because of that fact alone.

For past actions: For people/usernames I don't know very well, I do not put it past any Trumper to pose as an independent or otherwise obscure their voting party in order to get people to let their guards down, spread vaccine disinformation, and other disinformation and right wing talking points, in order to put up a facade and make people trust them more online. This is because outright being a Trumper doesn't work very well anymore. It's a common tactic in use by these individuals. I can't tell you how many I have been right about this elsewhere online, and they reveal themselves when backed into the corner of an argument. I have lost count. Here, however, I have apologized and owned up to my mistakes towards other posters in the past, and smoothed things over with the posters involved. My right wing radar has always - generally - been accurate in the past down to a few characters because of their speech patterns, but I can be wrong as well, and I am not afraid to admit when I am wrong.

And I meant it.

I'll also admit because of my past actions, yes, I was angry. But not anymore. And this election's aftermath has been difficult to work through. We are on the verge of losing the very fabric of our democracy that our grandfathers fought for because of a worthless fascist demagogue who worships Putin, Kim Jong-Un, and Hitler. And he has his little buddy Leon Muskolini working for him. I'm not very happy about that at all. All threats need to be taken seriously. I know we all feel the same way here.

We have a great fight ahead of us still. We still have to come back together as democrats and put an end to the infighting and focus on the future. We should not leave ourselves to split the party in two or three or more factions in a ton of different ways. That's where the republican party should be going. Not us.

John Pavlovitz explained it perfectly (I included a portion of his write-up at the end of this post). The conclusion of the 107 days of this election was so much more than just "losing an election." It was a loss of hope...of what can be. And what we will not have.

By the way...I really need to take a page out of Slider_Quinn21's book and simply turn off the news entirely for a bit. It just continues to get worse, darker, and even more depressing. I need to focus on more positive things. The sequel is, more often than not, much worse than the original.

====================================================================

We're Not Going Back. Or Are We? - by John Pavlovitz

https://johnpavlovitz.substack.com/p/we … kor-are-we

This isn’t just a political loss, as devastating as that has been to come to grips with.

It is about so much more than a transfer of power and a Congressional renovation and the legislative ripples that will result.

This is about about one hundred and seven hopeful days, and the fact that there could have been so many more. It is about grieving the what-might-have-beens and the what-never-will-be’s.

I was talking with a dear friend last week and she said to me, “The last one hundred and seven days gave me something that I’d given up on: they gave me hope. Instead of spending the past three months mentally and practically preparing myself for the horrible things that I’d previously resigned myself to, I ended up getting fooled into believing again. That’s what hurts the most.”

She felt she’d gotten distracted by months of hope, only to have it all snatched away in a matter of hours. There’s an emotional whiplash to it all that many of us are living with right now.

And that’s probably the heart of this grieving.

Over one hundred and seven days, many of us went from a place of certain dread and resignation, to the prospect of possibility; and almost reluctantly to an expectation of victory, to anticipatory joy, to preemptive elation—and now we feel like that’s all been squandered time. It feels like a waste.

But I don’t believe the last one hundred and seven days have been wasted at all. I believe they were reminding us just what the hell we live for, and because that is the place we begin. That is the spot from where we start today: they why of our lives.

I think you may be misinterpreting. I am not mischaracterizing anything. My LOL, once again, is talking about the hypocrisy of it all and republicans in general and how the army is screaming about President Biden pardoning Hunter when Trump himself is appointing a criminal he pardoned as the ambassador to France, and that republicans themselves have nothing but hypocrisy in electing an official doing that.

Never once did I levy any comments to suggest that I was downplaying any threats.

All republicans deserve mockery and ridicule for what they push on FOX (Faux) News and Newsmax as real news.

Sorry, but that's reality and the truth.

I will never respect a republican. Ever. Again.

Definitely not! LOL

Some small, good news this election cycle. Finally.

Derek Tran has declared victory over terrible Trumper Michelle Steel:

Derek Tran maintains lead over Michelle Steel as vote counts trickle in

https://laist.com/news/politics/democra … -26-update

Derek Tran declares victory in California's 45th U.S. House District 3 weeks after Election Day

https://www.nbclosangeles.com/decision- … n/3569565/

This was definitely a gross miscalculation on their part. Sadly.

The article is on point, ireactions. With Trump in government ready to implement Project 2025 with all the loyalists at his side, what is government going to look like by the midterms? Will it even be recognizable? Will we even have midterms? I know President Biden is trying to push through the judges he can. As well as make other changes to help stem the tide of the impact of effects of a second Trump term. What if elections are abolished on the first day of Trump's new term? What do we do?

Will Dems be able to act in time to preserve what we have? Do they have time to pivot and adjust their strategy?

The latest shows Trump is shoring up the White House's budget office with Project 2025 co-author Russell Vought:

https://www.cnn.com/2024/11/22/politics … index.html

You are not wrong. After having some time to calm down a bit, and even though I will elicit much dread for existing at all, I am going to say this:

I agree 100% here. Democrats are terrible...TERRIBLE...at social media. They cannot even put together the basics of a mediocre social media campaign. They NEED an overall social media communications manager who is savvy and knows the space in order to be the most effective at turning that space into votes. So far, they haven't been all that successful at doing this. If it's one major weakness they have that needs to be addressed, it's this one.

At the risk of being attacked for saying good things about Kamala: Until Kamala's team came along, there was not much dems were doing on social media. They kept losing ground a lot. Kamala's team brought a breath of fresh air to a failed social media presence. But it wasn't enough.

107 days left of the campaign simply was not enough to overcome what was already losing ground. If it's one thing republicans are good at over Democrats is social media. Even if Trump's team posted a sinking ship because of low morale, and they were hacked by Iran at the same time, the republicans are good at recovering on social media. They have a much larger, more organized, savvy, and pointed presence that puts Democrats on social media to shame.

Republicans can broadcast fake news and misaligned talking points designed to trick voters into believing one thing when the truth is really something else (notice that there are voters who thought the ACA was not the same as Obamacare and how shocked they were when they found out that the ACA *IS* Obamacare). And all of this because republicans are good at nicknaming things on social media and broadcasting that to more people in a way that led people to believe it over the actual truth. The question here is: how do you get people to always do their research first and confirm that what they believe is false when the algorithm is tailored to their interests and cognitive biases, rather than fact?

Dems have a long road ahead to get good enough at social media to overcome this and they need to start now. Not a month before the midterms. But they need to begin to prepare now.

I believe this article on "Salon" which is a questionable source is largely unfair. Everyone already knew by then what Kamala stood for: that Israel has and should continue to have the right to defend itself. But that both Israel and Palestine should be able to coexist. What Trump will be doing the first day he is in office? He will be removing all weapons delays to Israel, and Netanyahu will be able to incinerate any and all Palestinians as he pleases. - https://www.yahoo.com/news/trump-said-l … 3989.html.

I fully disagree with the assessment that "Trump bulldozed them." No he didn't. He spouted nonsense and hurled racist insults at Kamala and Puerto Ricans, threatened the assassination of political rivals, threatened shooting the press, and could barely string two words together. And he held a 1939-like Nazi Rally at MSG. And he "bulldozed them"? No he didn't. He damned well didn't.

I also fully disagree that the democratic party needs to change. And I am NOT afraid to point the finger where it squarely belongs. The proof will come out. It will. You can continue to hurl name calling and abuse at me because I certainly don't want to talk about "how the democratic party can change". Because that's not the freaking issue. And that is BS largely spread by Bernie who is a senile old coot. And it's gaslighting to tell us that that it is the issue when it's not.

We obviously don't see eye to eye. And that's okay. But you don't have to hurl name calling at me and tell me to leave because for whatever reason, you dislike Kamala. I am not a Bernie bro. I really do not like him at all because he's just another old man and not what the government needs to be successful.

Hopefully I am allowed to have a different opinion here. If not, oh well.

As the woman who proceeded to count "what the Rethuglicans deemed illegal" votes in Bucks County, PA despite Supreme Court objection says "Trump doesn't have to follow the law so why do we?" Eff the right wing extremist Supreme Court. If they're a vote, count them all.

About Democratic party messaging...I've been thinking about ways to communicate my point better, but this post writes and communicates it perfectly.

So, I will just leave this here.

No, the Democratic Party Can't "Message Better" to Racism, Misogyny, and Ignorance

https://johnpavlovitz.substack.com/p/no … nt-message

In the wake of the election results, one of the most common media postmortems has been the Democratic Party’s supposed failure to reach those Americans who they were unable to persuade over the course of the campaign; rural and working class voters, especially. The airways have been filled with politicians and talking heads offer their critiques and suggestions on how Democrats need to rethink how they are messaging.

I’m sorry, but that’s largely nonsense.

This election result isn't about Dem messaging.

Their messaging during the campaign was pitch-perfect in any other iteration of America. It was about helping the middle class, lowering taxes for the average American, continuing with sound economic policies to cut rising grocery prices, preserving democracy, taxing the wealthy, affordable healthcare and education, the rights of women, strengthening the border, unity, opportunity.

Kamala Harris and Tim Walz formed a balanced ticket filled with character, intellect, and genuine love for this country, and they eloquently delivered their vision beautifully. Their respective resumes contained exemplary histories of their work on behalf of the working people of this nation. They were experienced, mature, and competent.

And none of these realities could overcome the America that we’ve become—or at least a sizable portion of it has.

This election result isn’t about policy or platform, it’s about racism, misogyny, lack of education—and a Right-wing media machine that caters to those realities.

There is no messaging strategy that can overcome deeply-held prejudice and rising ignorance, and those two factors are the only explanation for someone like Donald Trump even being the nominee, let alone getting 76 million votes.

Trump neither attempted to embrace working Americans nor offer them any substantive plans to help them, because he knew he didn’t need to. He simply peddled wild, racist fever-dreams and continually repeated grotesque fabricated nightmares about immigrants eating pets and sex-change operations on middle school students, knowing that terrified people without critical thinking skills are an easy mark.

For months, while Kamala Harris and Tim Walz breathlessly traversed the country laying out their concrete plans for a diverse nation where every human being would receive an opportunity to thrive, detailing support for first-time homebuyers and small business owners and adult parental caregivers—Donald Trump and J.D. Vance blasted people with nonsensical verbal-diarrhea rally rants about violent foreign hordes coming to rape women and about child predators lurking in public bathrooms.

And the results were what they were: more people chose a mythical war against non-existent problems, instead of sound policies delivered by reasonable human beings, because at the end of the day, they took the politics of least resistance. They objected to the hours necessary to read platforms and understand the issues at stake, in favor of a cheap and easy high that told them life was simple: everything was bad, enemies were advancing, and their vote would eliminate the bad people.

How the hell do you “message” against that?

Pressed in his disastrous debate with Kamala Harris about his supposed healthcare plan, this several-times bankrupt, convicted felon and court adjudicated rapist who has had four years as president and nearly a decade as the Republican Party’s de-facto leader, admitted to having only “the concept of a plan.” (Translation: the plan, is you getting sick or going broke or dying prematurely.) That alone would and should have disqualified him from office—but he said he’d kick out the black and brown people, erase trans kids, and destroy “wokeness”, so tens of millions of alleged adults said, “Yeah, he’s our guy!”

And people who are that cavalier and careless with something as important as the health and welfare of their families, cannot be reached with any methods, aside from Dems creating a lowest-common denominator, Left propaganda disinformation network that will offer competing simplistic platitudes. And that is a slippery slope, for sure.

We need to stop pretending there is some perfect Democratic candidate or magic messaging, to connecting with people who have abandoned objective reality and complex evaluation, and chosen to embrace their false fears and uninformed phobias— while failing to do the slightest bit of work to know what candidates' policies and plans are, and the complex impact those things will have on their families and workplaces and futures. (The huge spike in Internet searches of things like “How do tariffs work?”, “What is Project 2025?”, “Can they deport legal immigrants?”, and “Can I change my vote?” after the election, shows that whatever people were using to make one of the most consequential decisions in their lifetimes during the campaign, didn’t include the issues or platforms.)

I have always been as still am a registered Independent. Believe me, I know the Democratic Party isn’t perfect and that Kamala Harris and Tim Walz had flaws as any candidates would, but they provided this nation with a ticket and a campaign that should have been enough in the nation that we once were before 2016; before red hat-catch phrases and open racism and dehumanizing language usurped thorough examination of the complicated issues and the solutions to to those problems. Donald Trump invited people to stop thinking and to let fear lead them, and I’m not sure how we reverse that.

Kamala Harris and the Dems didn't fail America, they just exist in a nation where far too many people don't pay attention or care to understand what's actually happening.

Maybe more of them will now.

That, in general, is a question to ask Trumpers. They're the ones who refuse to follow the rules and wear masks and vaccinate. Dems, as a rule, do not. Until that happens, they will continue to be society's self-proclaimed victims.

There actually is a reason to vilify them because not wearing them harms everybody. Not vaccinating kids in school harms other children and can cause outbreaks. It can harm herd immunity and provide a breakthrough point for mutated viruses to take hold. There is at least one case of Polio in New York now. The disease had been completely wiped out. All thanks to anti-vaxxers who refuse modern medicine because of some horrific mutation of incorrect information they saw online.

I think I have a right to be offended by somebody who chooses to buck science and medical doctors because they are too stupid to see why it's important and they believe FOX News. I think I have a right to be offended by somebody who thinks aborting a 5mm zygote is equal to aborting a human being in the 9th month, and they actually think 9th month abortions actually happen. I think I have a right to be offended by somebody who completely rejects science and refuses to do anything about it. And I think they should continue to be ostracized by society because of it as a form of punishment.

I don't want their vote to contribute if I have to not be offended just so they can have the freedom to base their decisions on unfounded unscientific information because facts are less entertaining to them.

Your first point is interesting, Slider_Quinn21. I tend to think JD is just going to be a younger version of Trump except 1. He doesn't command the loyalty or the follower demand like you mentioned, 2. He has called Trump America's Hitler. So...I'll keep that in the back of my mind. I just don't know.

I really hope you're right on your second point. But, Trump's father lived to be about 94 so they do have longevity... (I'm trying not to think about that right now)...

You could be right. Inexperience could have its good side. But, JD Vance has been quoted as saying (and I've seen him say all this), which makes me terrified of there being a JD Vance presidency too:

https://www.thecut.com/article/jd-vance … uotes.html

He’s disconcerted by the idea that this country is being run by “childless cat ladies.”

He’s disturbed by teachers who don’t have children.

He thinks people with children should be rewarded with extra votes.

"Vance’s views on abortion — that it isn’t acceptable, even in cases of rape and/or incest, and that law enforcement should play a role in policing patients’ medical decisions — are strong, if not out of line with his hard-right pivot. Sound bites such as “the rejection of the American family is perhaps the most pernicious and the most evil thing the left has done in this country” don’t feel especially surprising, given the context. But, consider this hypothetical scenario he spun out about the fall of Roe v. Wade, before the Supreme Court actually overturned it. If abortion became illegal in his state (Ohio), he worried, then “every day George Soros sends a 747 to Columbus to load up disproportionately Black women to get them to go have abortions in California. And of course, the left will celebrate this as a victory for diversity — uh, that’s kind of creepy.” He went on to say that, due to the situation’s supposed creepiness, he would be “pretty sympathetic” to some sort of “federal response to prevent it from happening.” Which is itself a pretty creepy prospect."

He said he felt his most “female” on the day he was too weepy to watch Garden State.

He’s outlined a vision for the second Trump presidency that sounds a lot like dictatorship.

"During a 2021 podcast with a prominent men’s-rights activist, Vance called for a “de-woke-ification program” in which the right would “seize the institutions of the left, and turn them against the left.” He went on to say that, should Trump win in 2024, he would encourage his boss to “fire every single mid-level bureaucrat, every civil servant in the administrative state, replace them with our people. And when the courts stop you, stand before the country, and say — quoting Andrew Jackson — ‘the chief justice has made his ruling. Now let him enforce it.’” Based on a recent ABC interview, it sounds like Vance stands by that advice."

These are just snippets of some of the worst of what he's said.

Somehow, I don't think he'd be much better than Trump.

ireactions - I am back. I am still wrestling with much grief over this election, and I need to limit my posting activity until I am able to have a clearer head. Also, several things have evolved and I hope I will be allowed to at least post the following. I have added to this post further factual discussion of other aspects of this election below at the bottom of the post.

If you still don't want to talk about this at all, despite ample evidence, feel free to edit my post and delete the part you don't like about voting machine breaches. You don't have to respond to it. But I felt it was critical, factual information. It is never my intent to harass or be harmful or otherwise, and I am sorry that you feel that way about any of the information that I have provided. The information below, however, is provided by Harvard graduates in computer science and University computer science professors, as well as court cases and court documentation.

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That being said, here is my contribution to the overall arching thread discussion:

I don't think there is too much wrong on the democratic side. The things happening now that need to stop is infighting and blaming other dems for the loss of this election. Kamala's campaign was well-executed. She included the working class, and highlighted what she brought to the table versus Trump. It is also indicated in Google Searches that the phrase "can I change my vote" jumped in Google Search trends immediately after the election by 700%, including an increase in 250% for queries about tariffs. Clearly, either dems didn't do a good job explaining more about what Trump was going to do (which I have a hard time believing because Kamala spent a good chunk of time in all of her speeches talking about what Trump was going to do), or people didn't pay attention to Kamala's speeches at all and they simply paid attention to all of the right wing talking points spread on social media networks instead.

Other things that I think contributed:

1. When President Joe Biden stepped out of the race, the media were jumping on his age 24/7. They didn't even bother jumping down Trump, who is the same age (80), and is even worse as far as mental acuity goes. The double standard did more to harm the democratic side than anything else. And I fully blame the media for that aspect.

2. There was constant misinformation spread on Twitter about everything Kamala was doing. And voters listened to this over anything else (likely).

3. Voters simply did not do their research on Trump before voting, as is shown by the fact that there is significant voter remorse over this election. Had they known, there may have been a dem landslide.

4. Voters simply ignored Kamala's speeches, and did not let things sink in. Or they simply didn't know who was running. Jimmy Kimmel did a segment on the streets where he asked voters about the election the day after the election, and none of them 1. Knew who was running, 2. Knew the election was already over. How much of this is pervasive within our society so that it negatively impacts voters?

I honestly don't think there is anything much about the democratic party we need to change. All of the above are factors that we cannot control 100%, which is the perception of voters about the candidates, and whether they do their research ahead of time. We cannot change what we cannot control. In which case, there isn't really much of a strategy that we can implement.

I do, however, think we need to stop the infighting and blaming and focus on the next mid term elections. Assuming we even have them in 2026.

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1. The other information. ireactions - You may delete this section permanently if you don't like it. And again, it's my last post with this information. I won't post about voting machines again.

2. Also, please don't waste any more of your time responding if you don't like it.
==============================================================

First, there has been additional information coming to light, including an FBI investigation of Polymarket, in which the CEO's home was just raided by the FBI:

https://www.axios.com/2024/11/13/polyma … yne-coplan

There has also been a letter, backed by Harvard graduate computer scientists and University Professors, sent to VP Kamala Harris which shows specific evidence of security breaches that could have resulted in this outcome. This evidence comes from court cases and court documentation, not heresay on social media:

https://freespeechforpeople.org/compute … ification/

And if you read the letter (link below), the evidence is outlined specifically and in full. But, and I will emphatically state this: the letter states that there is no indication of voter fraud happening in the 2024 elections. Just that there is highly circumstantial evidence of breaches by Trump operatives at earlier times that warrant a deeper investigation.

https://freespeechforpeople.org/wp-cont … 111324.pdf

In light of the Polymarket information, it is also telling that 1. Elon Musk posted the results of this election a week early on October 30, 2024, saying that "The prophecy will be fulfilled." and 2. The results come from Polymarket, which has never accurately predicted an election. Ever. Again, this is highly circumstantial, and I am only offering this as extremely suspicious behavior. Not proof.

https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1851659311132692541

In this screenshot, the right image is Elon's post showing the election results a week early on October 30, 2024. The left post are the final election results on Google.

That is all I will say, and is my last post on the topic.