Re: Reboots: The Return of Sliders (?), Quantum Leap, and Other Properties

Decent ratings?

https://tvline.com/ratings/quantum-leap … 235055066/

Re: Reboots: The Return of Sliders (?), Quantum Leap, and Other Properties

This is excellent news. I totally missed watching Quantum Leap and didn't know it was back finally. Haven't seen many ads for it.

Re: Reboots: The Return of Sliders (?), Quantum Leap, and Other Properties

It's odd but it is premium access to view on Peacock -- yet on NBC app, S2E1 is free. 

There was a fair amount of promotion for the premiere, but I suspect it was on channels you dont really watch.  Like, aimed at the network tv viewer.

Re: Reboots: The Return of Sliders (?), Quantum Leap, and Other Properties

RussianCabbie_Lotteryfan wrote:

It's odd but it is premium access to view on Peacock -- yet on NBC app, S2E1 is free. 

There was a fair amount of promotion for the premiere, but I suspect it was on channels you dont really watch.  Like, aimed at the network tv viewer.

Yeah, I don't watch network TV anymore. I've completely transitioned to the cord cutter life since 2018-ish.

They don't advertise on:

Hulu
Disney+
Peacock
Paramount+
YouTube
Amazon Prime
or Max.

All of my apps of choice.

Re: Reboots: The Return of Sliders (?), Quantum Leap, and Other Properties

I look forward to catching up with Dr. Ben tomorrow!

Re: Reboots: The Return of Sliders (?), Quantum Leap, and Other Properties

ireactions wrote:

I look forward to catching up with Dr. Ben tomorrow!

Me too!!!

Re: Reboots: The Return of Sliders (?), Quantum Leap, and Other Properties

I thought it was interesting how the Season 1 finale of QUANTUM LEAP 2.0 left it somewhat ambiguous whether or not Ben made it home. The Season 2 premiere takes it as a given that Ben didn't make it and plunges him into an increasingly insane military operation with one of the most stressful sequences I've ever seen on the show, and the Project QL team only appears in flashbacks for most of the episode.

The situation is messed up and strange, and the situation seems to mirror the original cancellation of QL1.0: Sam never made it home and neither did Ben, except where Sam's situation was an awkward afterthought on a season finale abruptly hammered into the frame of a series finale, QL2.0 is telling this story deliberately and willfullly. I wonder where it will go.

Re: Reboots: The Return of Sliders (?), Quantum Leap, and Other Properties

ireactions wrote:

I thought it was interesting how the Season 1 finale of QUANTUM LEAP 2.0 left it somewhat ambiguous whether or not Ben made it home. The Season 2 premiere takes it as a given that Ben didn't make it and plunges him into an increasingly insane military operation with one of the most stressful sequences I've ever seen on the show, and the Project QL team only appears in flashbacks for most of the episode.

The situation is messed up and strange, and the situation seems to mirror the original cancellation of QL1.0: Sam never made it home and neither did Ben, except where Sam's situation was an awkward afterthought on a season finale abruptly hammered into the frame of a series finale, QL2.0 is telling this story deliberately and willfullly. I wonder where it will go.

This is so good. QL season 2 is even better than season 1 so far. And from what I see: is that Melissa Roxburgh from Manifest as the captain of the mission?

Re: Reboots: The Return of Sliders (?), Quantum Leap, and Other Properties

How are people feeling about Quantum Leap so far this season?

Re: Reboots: The Return of Sliders (?), Quantum Leap, and Other Properties

Loved the season premiere, haven't gotten to the rest of the episodes yet. I'm betting it's awesome, though.

Re: Reboots: The Return of Sliders (?), Quantum Leap, and Other Properties

Former FOX and NBC executive on reboots:

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/t … 0633336542

Re: Reboots: The Return of Sliders (?), Quantum Leap, and Other Properties

I've been enjoying the multiple revivals of BUFFY THE VAMPIRE SLAYER, all set after the original TV show, all focusing on characters who aren't Buffy, all set in alternate continuities to each other. There's novel series SLAYER and CHOSEN by Kiersten White and the novel series IN EVERY GENERATION and ONE GIRL IN ALL THE WORLD by Kendare Blake as well as the Amazon Audible drama SLAYERS: A BUFFYVERSE STORY written by Amber Benson (!) with Christopher Golden and featuring James Marsters as Spike, Charisma Carpenter as Cordelia (!), Amber Benson as Tara, and Emma Caulfield as Anya (!). All three are separate stories that don't tie into each other. And while the Kiersten White series ties into the Dark Horse SEASON 8 comic books, the others choose their own path.

I'm especially astonished by the Audile because I honestly thought Amber Benson, Charisma Carpenter and Emma Caulfield were absolutely fed up with BUFFY THE VAMPIRE SLAYER. Also, their characters are all dead. But it turns out they're only fed up with it if Joss Whedon is involved, and they are happy to return if Amber Benson writes a story to bring them back.

I'll have more to say on all this later, but to bring BUFFY back as as spin-off media that focuses on new characters or supporting characters, and to give each product its own continuity.. well, that's intriguing.

613 (edited by RussianCabbie_Lotteryfan 2023-11-03 07:33:22)

Re: Reboots: The Return of Sliders (?), Quantum Leap, and Other Properties

ireactions wrote:

I've been enjoying the multiple revivals of BUFFY THE VAMPIRE SLAYER, all set after the original TV show, all focusing on characters who aren't Buffy, all set in alternate continuities to each other. There's novel series SLAYER and CHOSEN by Kiersten White and the novel series IN EVERY GENERATION and ONE GIRL IN ALL THE WORLD by Kendare Blake as well as the Amazon Audible drama SLAYERS: A BUFFYVERSE STORY written by Amber Benson (!) with Christopher Golden and featuring James Marsters as Spike, Charisma Carpenter as Cordelia (!), Amber Benson as Tara, and Emma Caulfield as Anya (!). All three are separate stories that don't tie into each other. And while the Kiersten White series ties into the Dark Horse SEASON 8 comic books, the others choose their own path.

I'm especially astonished by the Audile because I honestly thought Amber Benson, Charisma Carpenter and Emma Caulfield were absolutely fed up with BUFFY THE VAMPIRE SLAYER. Also, their characters are all dead. But it turns out they're only fed up with it if Joss Whedon is involved, and they are happy to return if Amber Benson writes a story to bring them back.

I'll have more to say on all this later, but to bring BUFFY back as as spin-off media that focuses on new characters or supporting characters, and to give each product its own continuity.. well, that's intriguing.

Very interesting to hear they got an audible orignal!

It's frustrating that -- post series -- SLIDERS has not gotten any additional material introduced.  Not even in novel form.   They haven't given us jack sh!t.   Tracy writing sliders novels would be a dream!  If he were up to it.

Re: Reboots: The Return of Sliders (?), Quantum Leap, and Other Properties

Kimon, who is basically THE X-FILES equivalent of Temporal Flux, was discussing Amazon Audible with me. I was bemused that FOX licensed THE X-FILES to Audible, and Audible's approach was very different from what it did with BUFFY THE VAMPIRE SLAYER.

With THE X-FILES, the creative approach was the decision that Audible wouldn't bother to write anything new and specific to the audio format. Instead, they printed off Joe Harris' first 25 comic book scripts for the IDW comic book series, had someone replace all the visual description with new dialogue, booked David and Gillian to record a first reading with no rehearsal, called this alternate continuity a prequel to the televised Season 10, and then told the suckers -- I mean, the fans -- to shell out their hard earned money for this microwaved regurgitation.

In contrast, BUFFY THE VAMPIRE SLAYER saw BUFFY actress (and novelist, director and screenwriter) Amber Benson write an original script and the production involved rehearsals. Why did BUFFY get the royal treatment while THE X-FILES got rehashes comic book scripts -- comic book scripts in an audio medium!

Kimon pointed out: SLAYERS: A BUFFYVERSE STORY did not actually feature Sarah Michelle Gellar as Buffy or David Boreanaz as Angel. SLAYERS is about the supporting cast characters: Spike, Cordelia, Tara, Anya -- actors who don't cost as much as A-list stars. In contrast, THE X-FILES had David Duchovny and Gillian Anderson.

Kimon theorized that hiring David Duchovny and Gillian Anderson to read for Audible with no rehearsals over the course of two half-days probably cost 80 - 90 percent of the budget of the average Audible project. This could be why Audible didn't write anything new for their audio drama and instead used pre-existing scripts even when those scripts were for comic books, a visual medium totally opposed to audio drama.

In contrast, James Marsters, Charisma Carpenter, Amber Benson and Emma Caulfield Ford could be hired for less and with rehearsals included. They don't command the same price for their time.

Re: Reboots: The Return of Sliders (?), Quantum Leap, and Other Properties

This is why I am always pro "the more IP, the better" (generally speaking, if a universe is really suffering from a lack of new on-going content). 

If there are misfires, some of it can usually be chalked up to making the numbers work.   I don't expect studios or distributors to take big bets to hope it reaches some breakout status or at least passes some critical threshold where more consumers discover it.   I think they need to do the best they can, while making reasonable bets and sometimes making sacrifices.   

For example, I would take a poor SLIDERS story narrated by any of the original four main actors and be happy just to have any of them doing the character again.  I'd still see it as a net gain.

I do think there can be a point of over-saturation though.  I can see a fan not being happy with a new introduction if they feel like they've already had their "fill" from other works and any new addition should only come into the picture if it won't dilute or harm the universe.

I can also see how it can be a bit disappointing to have something that doesn't hold up or you can't re-engage with because it just becomes bothersome to tolerate.

I'll always though have sympathy for the budgetary constraints in these situations because I think a lot of times we don't get new works from old properties because distributors or studios don't want to spend any money at all.

Re: Reboots: The Return of Sliders (?), Quantum Leap, and Other Properties

The danger is that when a brand is associated with a poor product, the audience catches on eventually and knows to stay away. At this point, Audible doesn't even have THE X-FILES: COLD CASES and STOLEN LIVES available for purchase because COLD CASES sold so poorly. The first-reading & recording production of COLD CASES was so poor and unprofessional that it repelled the audience from any future TXF Audible projects.

If Audible wanted to do something with the license and couldn't commission new scripts, the solution would have been to choose 10 short stories from the three Titan Books published THE X-FILES anthologies for Duchovny and Anderson to read out loud.

The anthologies, TRUST NO ONE, THE TRUTH IS OUT THERE and SECRET AGENDAS were a mixed bag. Titan Books clearly took first drafts from any mid-list fantasy author and did little copy-editing or revision. The stories are filled with typos and peculiarities like mid-90s stories with smartphones or Mulder and Scully working for the FBI in 2004 (when they would have been in hiding). But across three volumes, there were certainly 10 stories worth recording. (Probably not more than 10.)

**

I've just finished SLAYERS: A BUFFYVERSE STORY and it's good with some flashes of greatness.

SLAYERS definitely is not series creator Joss Whedon's BUFFY. Instead, it's distinctly AMBER BENSON'S SLAYERVERSE. Writer-actress Amber Benson has created an alternate universe parallel to the original BUFFY timeline where the supporting and second-tier characters get to shine. SLAYERS focuses on alternate universe versions of Cordelia, Anya and Tara (since the original timeline versions are dead) and uses the original Spike to introduce these doubles and eventually cede the center stage to Cordelia, Anya and Tara.

Benson noticeably makes no attempt to pastiche Whedon's writing style. Where Whedon's scripts were snappy, sardonic, filled with references to 1980 - 2000 era fantasy films, TV, and comic books, Benson and co-writer Christopher Golden choose a more thoughtful pace of gentle interaction and a strong emphasis on female friendship and female intimacy. Some fans and reviewers have complained that BUFFY THE VAMPIRE SLAYER stories should mimic Whedon's approach, but this is distinctly not a BUFFY story, and eventually reveals itself to be Cordelia's story.

The writing certainly has a few weak points where characters at times exposit characterization for no apparent reason. The new Slayer, Indira, inexplicably analyzes stuffy librarian Giles' past as a punk rebel in a massive information dump that is more like a fan essay than a conversation and Indira and Giles have almost no interaction afterwards. Cordelia tells Indira not to ask Cordelia about Cordy's dead sister; then Cordelia proceeds to describe what happened to her sister immediately afterwards. (This at least turns out to be relevant.)

The plot certainly gets a little laboured, trying to re-establish the original BUFFY timeline and build a baseline of reality because shifting into a parallel reality for contrast, trying to do world-building across two timelines. Benson does not have Whedon's wit or Tracy Torme's cleverness in establishing original-universe story elements to later parallel and invert and an alternate universe. There is a workmanlike lack of artistry that is below the level of, say, the SLIDERS pilot. However, Benson's characterization and pairings and amusing humour are enjoyable and the new Cordelia, Anya and Tara are compelling, and in the end, the appeal of the characters and conversations alleviate the strained storyline.

The story is incredibly satisfying and yet ends on a soft cliffhanger where, as far as SLAYERS and potential SLAYERS sequels are concerned, their main priority is this timeline, the Cordyverse, where Cordelia Chase is the Vampire Slayer and the star. The character of Spike from the original timeline remains in this parallel universe, but his presence is indicated as temporary. This is clearly Amber Benson's vision of what the Slayerverse (as opposed to the Buffyverse) can be. The emphasis is on the women who are and can be Slayers rather than on a specific Slayer from one specific writer.

It's very fitting, given how poorly treated Cordelia and actress Charisma Carpenter were on the original shows, that Cordelia and Carpenter now have a new series that positions them as the lead in a separate timeline that will give Benson the freedom to do as she pleases with these alternate-universe versions of Cordelia, Anya and Tara. I hope there are sequels, and yet, I don't feel this story would be marred if there weren't any, because it leaves Cordelia, Anya and Tara back in action at frontline of their own stories again.

Re: Reboots: The Return of Sliders (?), Quantum Leap, and Other Properties

You couldn't pay me to listen to this Audible crap.  They should have at least animated it!

Re: Reboots: The Return of Sliders (?), Quantum Leap, and Other Properties

It's one thing if someone's personal tastes don't turn towards audio. Some people may not like the medium. Some may have hearing disabilities that make audio inaccessible. But:

Grizzlor wrote:

You couldn't pay me to listen to this Audible crap. They should have at least animated it!

These two sentences are so foundationally and factually flawed that I feel compelled to go through each level individually.

It's regarding one of my very favourite subjects, so this is actually terrific (for me).

Grizzlor wrote:

You couldn't pay me to listen to this Audible crap. They should have at least animated it!

This statement is factually unreasonable in terms of licensing rights. The license to create audioplays based on an intellectual property does not extend to creating animation; that is an entirely separate licensing agreement that would go to an actual animation studio as opposed to an audio drama company like Audible.

Grizzlor wrote:

You couldn't pay me to listen to this Audible crap. They should have at least animated it!

This statement is declaring that audio drama is a low budget substitute for television, a form of TV without pictures. That is and completely false. Audio drama predates television and film; it's a medium that's existed since the 1920s.

Audio drama is not an attempt to do TV without pictures. Audio drama is a medium of its own, existing in the realm of sound to illicit emotion, environment, and imagination.

Radio drama was a means of broadcasting live and recorded stageplay content into homes on a national and eventually international scale. Original radio drama that was written specifically for the audio medium began by 1923. Radio drama evolved into audio drama sold on CD in the 1980s. Radio and audio drama have now developed into modern day podcast fiction and non-fiction with drama, dramatizations, documentaries and news. The only difference between modern podcast drama and modern audio drama: podcast tends to refer to ongoing serieses on a regular schedule. Audio drama implies an individual release.

Seminal works of audio drama include Douglas Adams' genre-defining THE HITCHHIKER'S GUIDE TO THE GALAXY and Orson Welles' adaptation of WAR OF THE WORLDS. Modern podcast dramas and audio dramas of tremendous success include WELCOME TO NIGHT VALE, DIRTY JOHN, THE SANDMAN, LIMETOWN, THE LOVECRAFT INVESTIGATIONS and others. Audio drama is an important and successful medium in which new work and advancement continues to this very day.

Audio drama is a vibrant medium with a long history and a future that will continue no matter how many streaming services rise and fall for one very simple reason: compared to TV and film, audio drama is inexpensive and doesn't take a lot of time to produce.

Grizzlor wrote:

You couldn't pay me to listen to this Audible crap. They should have at least animated it!

This statement conveys, hopefully unintentionally, a marked prejudice and bias against any medium that lacks visual motion, saying that the written and spoken word is not only outside their personal preference, but outside this person's capacity to respect as avenues of fiction. This would dismiss not only audio drama, but prose novels, poetry, comic books, picturebooks, boardgames, and, for that matter, internet message boards.

In actuality, motion is not a requirement for a storytelling format, nor is audio drama deficient or disabled by its lack of moving pictures.

Audio drama uses peformance and sound design to create scale, imagery, emotion, action and interaction. Audio drama is a complex, challenging, compelling, vivid medium with its own strengths, weaknesses, merits, flaws, all of which have to be navigated with skill, talent, knowledge, experience and a passion for storytelling.

Modern day audio drama boasts a cutting edge level of storytelling, creativity and diversity because audio faces significantly fewer barriers to creativity and requires far fewer resources than TV and film while demanding a tremendous level of storytelling skill in using only sound to create characters and situations.

Grizzlor wrote:

You couldn't pay me to listen to this Audible crap. They should have at least animated it!

This statement dismisses the artistic merit of the audio medium. They would be saying audio drama cannot possibly present strong storytelling with skill, craft, or artistic value of any kind. That would be a deeply uninformed statement that would show a high level of literary ignorance.

Audio drama has a long and prestigious history which includes numerous giants of literature from the twentieth century straight through to today: Rod Serling, Dylan Thomas, Samuel Beckett, Harold Pinter, Robert Bolt, Agatha Christie, Isaac Asimov, JRR Tolkien, Neil Gaiman, Seth MacFarlane, Felicia Day and more. Performers include Laurence Olivier, Orson Welles, Leonard Nimoy and other thespian masters.

Most modern franchises including STAR WARS, Superman, Batman, DOCTOR WHO, Sherlock Holmes and more have extensive history in audio drama with audio drama being what kept DOCTOR WHO as a going concern during the lengthy hiatus when the TV show was off the air.

I find it puzzling that anyone would disdain work from Rod Serling, Samuel Beckett, Orson Welles, JRR Tolkien, Douglas Adams, Laurence Olivier, Leonard Nimoy, Neil Gaiman, Seth MacFarlane and Felicia Day on the grounds that it didn't have moving pictures.

Grizzlor wrote:

You couldn't pay me to listen to this Audible crap. They should have at least animated it!

This statement is complaining that an audio drama company (Audible) did not produce an animated feature. They would be saying that an audio project and an animation project require the same time, financial backing and resources. That would be confessing to a severe ignorance of how animation production compares to audio production.

Animation requires enormous levels of personnel for character designs and storyboarding with entire companies outside the US devoted to producing the actual animation, anywhere from 5 to 500 times the budget of an audio drama production. Audio drama requires a recording studio and performers. Anyone who seriously claims that audio drama and animation are on the same production scale is betraying how they are utterly clueless about audio drama and animation.

Grizzlor wrote:

You couldn't pay me to listen to this Audible crap. They should have at least animated it!

This statement is declaring that an audio drama company should be expected to create animation. That would be demonstrating a stunning level of overgeneralization in assuming that one form of media production is the same as any other form of media production.

Anyone who said that might as well complain that the mechanic has a lousy vegetable selection or that shoe retailers are incompetent for not selling ovens.

Grizzlor wrote:

You couldn't pay me to listen to this Audible crap. They should have at least animated it!

Please accept my profuse gratitude for these two sentences as they gave me an excuse to talk about audioplays which are one of my favourite subjects.

Re: Reboots: The Return of Sliders (?), Quantum Leap, and Other Properties

I know FULLY well why they did the audio drama as opposed to anything else.  It's still a missed opportunity, if you ask me, and I am NOT opposed to audio dramas.  I simply wished this project were more than that.  You get all these original actors, it would have been much cooler. 

That being said, I know the guy was a jerk, but I have no reason to have any interest in a Buffy project not guided by Joss Whedon.  It was his concept, and should end with him.

Re: Reboots: The Return of Sliders (?), Quantum Leap, and Other Properties

Grizzlor wrote:

I know the guy was a jerk, but I have no reason to have any interest in a Buffy project not guided by Joss Whedon.  It was his concept, and should end with him.

I can respect that. There are certain properties I feel should only be produced by their original creators or not at all. I have zero interest in a SCOTT PILGRIM project that isn't led by Bryan Lee O'Malley. I'm not going to watch the Netflix adaptation of AVATAR: THE LAST AIRBENDER because creators Michael Dante DiMartino and Bryan Konietzko aren't involved. I would never want more CALVIN AND HOBBES without Bill Watterson.

However, I would simply note that BUFFY was a set of feminist themes written within a house style and many, many, many writers adopted this house style and made it their own. David Fury had a more fast-paced approach than Whedon, Ben Edlund was more horrific, Jane Espenson was more comedic, Marti Noxon was more melodramatic and Jeffrey Bell was more earnest, and a lot of writers could do a great job with the BUFFY property and not abuse or harrass anyone while doing it. But regardless, there is nothing wrong with not being interested in a BUFFY project that isn't coming from BUFFY's creator.

However however... a thread about reboots is probably going to feature properties that are being shepherded by people who didn't originally create said properties.

Re: Reboots: The Return of Sliders (?), Quantum Leap, and Other Properties

Sliders should have came back as a Thanksgiving special.  Sigh.

Re: Reboots: The Return of Sliders (?), Quantum Leap, and Other Properties

ireactions wrote:

However, I would simply note that BUFFY was a set of feminist themes written within a house style and many, many, many writers adopted this house style and made it their own. David Fury had a more fast-paced approach than Whedon, Ben Edlund was more horrific, Jane Espenson was more comedic, Marti Noxon was more melodramatic and Jeffrey Bell was more earnest, and a lot of writers could do a great job with the BUFFY property and not abuse or harrass anyone while doing it. But regardless, there is nothing wrong with not being interested in a BUFFY project that isn't coming from BUFFY's creator.

That's fair, Marti and David wrote most of the scripts anyway on Buffy & Angel.  Either way, I find audio dramas boring.  Granted some animation is terrible, like that awful anime Supernatural season from Japan!